Air Compressors

[TCT]

Ok, so I went a little stalker-esk on you and google mapped your location, looks like you guy have buried power lines which is not a huge help here. But It looks like it is somewhat industrial in the general area. Do you know if anyone around you has 3 phase? If it is close you can ask the power company for a quote on what a upgrade would run. They may want you or your "electrician" fill out a usage worksheet. The trick here is to make them think you are going to be drawing A LOT of power, that way they get their money for the upgrade back eventually. This may be hard with the 200 Amp service like I said. But when I filled out our worksheet, I took into consideration the load test I did with everything running which was like 189 Amps or something, took the max power our new press and flashes would take during peek, figured we would need a few more fans, another stereo, brighter lights, Probably another AC unit because it was going to be hotter now, you get the idea. Anyway my peek number was in the mid 300's, with my mean being upper 200's. That made the power company "sharpen their pencil" for the outside upgrade, $20K-> $0

[Homer]

i didn't read all the replies so sorry if this has been mentioned. I JUST went through all this with my 10 color gauntlet 2 so it's fresh in my head. you said something about 20-30cfm with all heads working, it's not the heads that suck air, it's the indexer and lift cylinder. Without knowing your set up and true usage, I would look at the possibility of setting up another compressor as a secondary so you don't overload your main. twin compressors though a chiller, 3/4" line out to a "T" at press branching off to a 60 gal captive holding tank. the initial "whoosh" of air as it indexes will come out of your holding tank as well as the compressors tank so your compressor isn't constantly running....I may be wrong in this thinking though as I don't know your cfm needs.

[Binkspot]

You will run out of space long before amperage. The only time it may be close is if everything turns on at the exact same time. Your dryer and flashes will not draw name plate amperage, only until they warm up. The press will draw about the same as a few light bulbs. Compressor only at start up which can be dampened with high output start and run capacitors. Like I said the last time at the old shop if you are a little gun shy about the load just turn one thing on at a time at the beginning of the day. Typically services will handle about 10% larger then the rated main breaker.

Our old shop, 200a service single phase. Press 20 amps, drew about 14, two quarts flashes 70a each for the first 2 or 3 flashes, once warmed up down to 27 each. Compressor 25 at start, 12a run. Then the two dryers, one 60a the other 20. Add the IR flash on the manual another 15. Then the heat in the office in the winter because they are cold another 30a. Throw in a couple of heat presses, lights, refrigerator and some other stuff,  never had a problem.

If you have the power company come out see if they will give you 460v. Then you can cut your load in half, add a transformer to step down to 208 single for house keeping and have them add a 277v panel for lighting.  sorry couldn't resist.

[Printficient]

Chicago Pneumatic makes a very good screw for what used to be (haven't priced any out for custy's in a while) about 20-30% less than the big boys.  Good compressors.

[ZooCity]

Chicago Pneumatic makes a very good screw for what used to be (haven't priced any out for custy's in a while) about 20-30% less than the big boys.  Good compressors.

That's what we have. Most bang for the buck out there I think. This is basically an atlas copco.  Go with a screw not just for the noise but for the fact they can run under continuous load. Also, when you add it all up a new rotary screw/chiller combo is close in pricing to a new reciprocating type plus chiller.

[JBLUE]

You will run out of space long before amperage. The only time it may be close is if everything turns on at the exact same time. Your dryer and flashes will not draw name plate amperage, only until they warm up. The press will draw about the same as a few light bulbs. Compressor only at start up which can be dampened with high output start and run capacitors. Like I said the last time at the old shop if you are a little gun shy about the load just turn one thing on at a time at the beginning of the day. Typically services will handle about 10% larger then the rated main breaker.

Our old shop, 200a service single phase. Press 20 amps, drew about 14, two quarts flashes 70a each for the first 2 or 3 flashes, once warmed up down to 27 each. Compressor 25 at start, 12a run. Then the two dryers, one 60a the other 20. Add the IR flash on the manual another 15. Then the heat in the office in the winter because they are cold another 30a. Throw in a couple of heat presses, lights, refrigerator and some other stuff,  never had a problem.

Turning everything on in phases also saves you on billing if your power company bases you billing off of the spike you pull for the 24 hour period. Edison here does that. It can get expensive when all the flashes, compressor, lights, dryers, and everything else gets turned on at the same time.



If you have the power company come out see if they will give you 460v. Then you can cut your load in half, add a transformer to step down to 208 single for house keeping and have them add a 277v panel for lighting.  sorry couldn't resist.

[Binkspot]

All seriousness, most of your load is inductive and 3p would only benifit the compressor and that would only save a few amps at best.

[Prosperi-Tees]

Is it technically ok to run 40ft of rubber air hose to the press? my neighbor is a plumber and could "hook" with copper runs and valves and flex etc etc. For $500. Is it worth it?

[Gilligan]

Is it technically ok to run 40ft of rubber air hose to the press? my neighbor is a plumber and could "hook" with copper runs and valves and flex etc etc. For $500. Is it worth it?

Gerry, why not look into this system?

http://www.rapidairproducts.com/

[Prosperi-Tees]

Is it technically ok to run 40ft of rubber air hose to the press? my neighbor is a plumber and could "hook" with copper runs and valves and flex etc etc. For $500. Is it worth it?

Gerry, why not look into this system?

http://www.rapidairproducts.com/

It is a little late for that. Tech coming Monday and I have 2 options.

#1 Put the compressor close to the press and use my existing rubber air hose. (not concerned with the noise)
           Electrical run would be more costly as it is furthest away from the panel.

#2 Put the compressor away from the press but would cost more in an air system.
          Electrical run will be cheaper as it would be closer to the panel

[Rockers]

Keep in mind I have 208 single phase 200 amp power in the shop. I like the "semi quietness" of these compressors. Anything I should look at? I looked at screw compressors but most are 3 phase and the single phase ones seem underpowered in CFM.

If you are going to have the compressor near you, do your self the favor and get a screw type. Sounds like you already know that though.
For the 3 phase issue, have you considered a phase converter?  We used to have only single phase, and a phase converter works well in that situation.  You can usually find them on craigslist and they really don't lose resale value once you use them. Might be worth looking into....  If where you are now is a place you think you will be for a long time, and there is 3phase somewhat close,  you may be able to get the power company to upgrade you.  Sometimes it costs a bit, but if you say the right things the cost can decrease quite fast.  We went from a $20k 3 phase upgrade to a $0 upgrade.

I totally agree, a screw type is the way to go. Our`s is just a few meters away from where we load and unload. And if you ever consider getting a second auto you can always upgrade a screw type to a more powerful compressor and run two automatics of it. All it takes is to get some parts ordered and installed .

[tonypep]

We have a Sullair 50H screw and a Curtis 25H screw running in tandem which in turn pipe the air through a system of 3 chiller/dryers such that the air is bone dry. It's a little complex but the whole system is hosed separately outside the bldg. Point is we got all this used from a very reputable compressor tech who did the install. So if you're careful you might look into that route. (Consulting a tech that is)

[Homer]

Is it technically ok to run 40ft of rubber air hose to the press? my neighbor is a plumber and could "hook" with copper runs and valves and flex etc etc. For $500. Is it worth it?

I've got 3/4" black iron coming out of my compressor into my chiller, then 50' of 1" flex hose coming out of my chiller into a "T" , one line into my press, the other into a captive tank. there's another line to my other machine is in there someplace too. The airline also acts like a holding tank so it can't hurt to have it longer....you get a bit more capacity out of a 80 gal tank, not much -but it's something.

[Gilligan]

Is it technically ok to run 40ft of rubber air hose to the press? my neighbor is a plumber and could "hook" with copper runs and valves and flex etc etc. For $500. Is it worth it?

Gerry, why not look into this system?

http://www.rapidairproducts.com/

It is a little late for that. Tech coming Monday and I have 2 options.

#1 Put the compressor close to the press and use my existing rubber air hose. (not concerned with the noise)
           Electrical run would be more costly as it is furthest away from the panel.

#2 Put the compressor away from the press but would cost more in an air system.
          Electrical run will be cheaper as it would be closer to the panel

Seems like you were dicking around with the wrong stuff. :p

Can you plumb it cheap and temp then get that system to do it right?

If not, time to pay the piper.. Hoses are cheaper than wires.

[bimmridder]

When we moved in to this building, I ran the Rapid Air pipe. Hundreds and hundred of feet of pipe feeding Three autos, one manual, Ink pumps, stretching tables, CTS, and drops for plain old air nozzles. Did it all in a weekend by myself. A lot of different size pipes. So damn easy. Costs more, yes, but less than a plumber. I can add drops anywhere in the system, or move them, too. Supposed to be more efficient because it's polished inside, but I can't verify that. (all that pipe equals extra holding capacity). When we were flooded in out last building and forced to move, we took out all the pipe and fittings that weren't under water. Removed and reused A LOT of pipe and fitting. So SO easy to use. I know that wasn't the question, but as  user of the stuff, I thought I'd share.