Air Compressors

[Prosperi-Tees]

I am starting research on air compressors so that when I can afford a new one I am well informed. My little 5hp Ingersol piston is gonna be sucking wind with the new 10 color challenger 1. So I have my eye on these, does anybody have any opinions on these? Keep in mind I have 208 single phase 200 amp power in the shop. I like the "semi quietness" of these compressors. Anything I should look at? I looked at screw compressors but most are 3 phase and the single phase ones seem underpowered in CFM.

http://www.eatoncompressor.com/catalog/item/504747/9381208.htm

http://www.homedepot.com/p/t/202075112?productId=202075112&storeId=10051&langId=-1&catalogId=10053&MERCH=REC%2d%5f%2dproduct%2d2%2d%5f%2d202075117%2d%5f%2d202075112%2d%5f%2dN#.UaJVdnbn-M8

[TCT]

Our first compressor was a Eaton. Great compressor! We actually still have it, and use it for extra CFM when needed. About 3 years after having it, it wouldn't turn over, called Eaton and in two days had a new motor at the door no questions. The problem actually turned out to be a bit of operator error and was running fine in a day. Eaton never asked for the motor back, and never charged us(shhhhhhhhh).

By the way, anyone want to buy a never used 10hp motor?

[Admiral]

Eaton is good, Champion is good, Ingersoll Rand I think is supposed to be good but I have heard complaints, could just be due to it being a popular brand though.  Kaeser is awesome and that's what I would want to go with for a rotary screw compressor.

Probably not a good idea to go with one from home depot / lowes / harbor freight etc.

[Binkspot]

You could just add a second IR to match the first one. Set one to come on 10-15 psi after the other.

Depending on the size of the existing tank you could also look at a second compressor/motor on a base plate, plum it into the existing tank.  Again set one to come on after the other.

Looking at the specs, both look like Eaton pumps. Like Admiral said I would stay away from an off brand, stick with IR, Curtis, Kaeser or Quincy.

I know Quincy makes some nice packaged screw compressor/dryer single phase in the 25-50 cfm range. I'm sure others like Kaeser do also.

Don forget you still need a chiller/dryer.

What ever you get spend a little extra and get soft mounts for the compressor either machinery felt or rubber/steel. It will help deaden the noise of the compressor.

[TCT]

Keep in mind I have 208 single phase 200 amp power in the shop. I like the "semi quietness" of these compressors. Anything I should look at? I looked at screw compressors but most are 3 phase and the single phase ones seem underpowered in CFM.

If you are going to have the compressor near you, do your self the favor and get a screw type. Sounds like you already know that though.
For the 3 phase issue, have you considered a phase converter?  We used to have only single phase, and a phase converter works well in that situation.  You can usually find them on craigslist and they really don't lose resale value once you use them. Might be worth looking into....  If where you are now is a place you think you will be for a long time, and there is 3phase somewhat close,  you may be able to get the power company to upgrade you.  Sometimes it costs a bit, but if you say the right things the cost can decrease quite fast.  We went from a $20k 3 phase upgrade to a $0 upgrade. 

[balloonguy]

I had really bad luck with my ir. I have not ever has 6 consecutive months of operation and the service sucks. I don't have any advise on a good compressor but save yourself the headache and go past ir.
Matt

[Prosperi-Tees]

Ok great advice. I really would like a screw compressor but will have to look into 3 phase. If that's not an option a single phase 7.5 hp screw puts out about 20 cfm compared to a 7.5 hp piston at 26 cfm. Do you guys think the screw would be a better choice still? The press I believe requires mid 20s to mid 30s running full bore which we will never run all heads at full speed.

[TCT]

Ok great advice. I really would like a screw compressor but will have to look into 3 phase. If that's not an option a single phase 7.5 hp screw puts out about 20 cfm compared to a 7.5 hp piston at 26 cfm. Do you guys think the screw would be a better choice still? The press I believe requires mid 20s to mid 30s running full bore which we will never run all heads at full speed.

After checking out your floor plans you posted, GET A SCREW TYPE!!!! You are wayyyyyyy to close to not have one. It will end up driving you crazy to hear the other one turn on and off all the time.

[Prosperi-Tees]

Yeah that's why I was looking at the quietist pistons I could find. What does running a 3 phase converter consist of and cost?

[TCT]

Yeah that's why I was looking at the quietist pistons I could find. What does running a 3 phase converter consist of and cost?

With out getting real technical, it is a little motor basically. Single phase comes in one side 3phase comes out the other. Depending on the type/model there is somewhere between a 1.5-7% efficiency loss. Again, depending on the size and type you need, I have seen them run between $500 and $2K, I would say around $1200 you would be safe. But you can resell these suckers for what you bought them for without a problem. You can make your own, but I would not advise it unless you are rather handy and have a GOOD understanding of electrical components.

[T Shirt Farmer]

I am not an electrician but a amp is an amp no matter single or 3 phase power, I would think if you had a item that required 45 amps single phase you would need 3ea 15 amp legs in a 3 phase scenario. Your 200 amp service may be a issue by the time you get 2 flash units a compressor,. outlets, lights, exposure unit and heating/air conditioning etc all wired up.

I have a Quincy 7.5 hp screw and for the money it was the best value. I think Kaiser is better unit but also +25% in cost. Good luck setting up the new press!

[Gilligan]

When it comes to motors, 3 phase is more efficient, so there would be energy savings there.  Not sure how much but there would be some.  Now, using a converter you are bound to lose efficiency.

[ScreenFoo]

The statistic I've heard is that 3ph is around 50% more efficient for motors--i.e. inductive, 'balanced' loads. 
No savings, for instance, on a 3ph dryer (because the load is resistive)

Sounds like TCT has done some homework on converters--they should be reasonably efficient, but they're spendy.  If you deal with one, make sure you or your electrician friend is up to speed on what all's inside, the 470V one I dealt with didn't have bleed resistors on the caps--easy death to a newb touching the wrong wire without checking it out...

[TCT]

3 phase and converters aside, I agree you may have a issue with the 200Amp service. We had to upgrade, and we don't even run our air conditioner year round up here. Have you ever done a load test with everything you have now running?
Are you planning on staying in your current location long? Long enough to justify an electrical upgrade? I can walk you through how we had our power company cover our 3 phase upgrade cost, but I can almost guarantee they won't do it if you only have 200Amp service.

[Prosperi-Tees]

Well I just signed the lease for 2 years. I was going to actually downsize the screen printing business and start another business in this same location. That other business did not pan out so we are ramping up operations and going full bore with where we are. I ran a javelin with a flash, compressor, lighting, fans and ac with 100 amp service so im pretty comfortable being with 200.
Compressor- 40amps
dryer- 60 amps
2 ir flashes - 50 roughly
small office ac- 20 amps