Why (In Toms personal opinion) you should not separate in PhotoShop channels

[inkman996]

Obviously star child is not aware of the back history of the myseps video, in other words star child there is more to it than you know so us arguing about is pointless.

[blue moon]

the final point here is:
ppl selling and promoting their product are not allowed to bash other products in order to further their cause. Comparison by members is fair and encouraged game!

so Dan can't publicly bash other separators or if you'd like, M&R cant talk crap about other companies, but are more than welcome to point out why they are better or the features they offer which are not available or are inferior with other brands (without naming) in general.

does that make sense?

[AdvancedArtist]

Just for the record I was not doing a comparison I was pointing out that the issues discussed in the video that started this post were obviously present in the Sim Process to Channels work flow. Over coming those issues can present significant challenges and workflow related difficulties. If posting videos from other is inhibited I can abide by that no problem.

[GraphicDisorder]

Public YouTube links are censored? 

I can't imagine why the link was removed. I checked the youtube link and the comments were not turned off-
So this very same thread could be discussed on MYSeps channel. I would prefer that MySeps sign on and say why
it's beneficial to pay for 12 screens for a shirt design. And the advantages of his technique of sepping.

The last time I experienced this was on the Faux News website.   

What's up editor in chief? (Is this your personal opinion?) Or did I miss this in the rules and regulations for posting?

Woosaa! I enjoy this site, so I'll take the good with the editing..

Why should my steps have to come on here and defend his work? why does Tom have to use someone else's hard work to advance his agenda?

Because he doesn't know how.

[Inkworks]

Advanced Artist, I'm a Corel guy, have been since Corel 4 I think. That said I've only really dabbled in vector, now that I have my own shop I'm seeing more and more raster art and having to sub it out for (sometimes) expensive seps. I can think of 6 jobs in the next 2 weeks that will require me to spend many, many hundreds in seps. which could easily make you program pay for itself in just 2 weeks, that's great ROI. I have never learned Photoshop or even Adobe Irritator (Illustrator).

I've watched many many of your videos and have learned a bunch, it all looks great!

All this add up to me being square in the middle of your target market. Except I'm not pulling the trigger because of the bad attitude, chip on the shoulder, "baggage" almost every post of yours carries. I don't want to support that. You come on to a guys own forum and start chipping away at him, attacking him and what he does for a living to further you own agenda. You take pot-shots belittling others work to try to boost your own stuff. That's bad business. DTD looks the good guy here because he's put up with most of the shots and guess what that makes you look like?

Forget what happened on other forums, don't drag it here, rise above that childish crap, your not trying to win an internet forum disagreement, you're selling a product you truly believe in.

Your stuff is good enough to stand on it's own merits, you don't need to compare it to others, you don't need to put down anyone else's work, you also don't need an avatar of yourself in a muscle-shirt semi-flexed. It all screams confrontation, aggressiveness and insecurity, all things most of us don't want of our professional life or as part of our business's.

Take off the muscle shirt and put on a nice polo or even a T for a new, business friendly avatar. Drop the digs at PS guys and their work. Don't take digs at guys on their own forum, that's classless and reflects badly on you and your product. Business isn't personal, so make it about business, not personal stuff. Keep up the great videos and pushing your stuff on it's merits, and don't bother with the comparisons. If it's that good then let the other guys try to compare their stuff to you.

(btw, I sure hope you've bought a banner here as all you've done is promote the way your product works.)

Keep up the excellent work furthering the industries understanding of color, HSB, high quality seps, minimum screens to do the same job and Corel in general, but be that wise, rational, approachable guy in the wings with a great product at a great price, not the aggressive guy in the muscle shirt that keeps trying to kick sand in other guys face.

Hell the RIP I bought was $1300, The printer >$2500, I bet I'm far from the only guy who'd drop a few (many many?) hundred on your products if they didn't come with the baggage.

my $0.02
Jon
Inkworks.

[lemorris]

Man...as one of the many un-gifted and ignorant producers of crap I gotta agree with you.

I just about deleted my account before I saw your post Jon, no kiddin.  It all reminds me of a darker time and I'm not sure I need that in my life again.  I'm gonna bounce till this blows over.  The bad energy is making me even crappier and more ignoranter.

I hope you cats find a happy place.

[Inkworks]

Being the Mod/Admin on another subjects forum for over a decade has numbed me to this sort of $hit Lemorris, put enough of any type of people together anywhere and there will always be a few ruffled feathers along the way. At least I haven't heard anyone being referred to as Hitler for stifling "Free Speech" yet... 

Look at it like mining for gold, you always have to move lots of crap to find a few nuggets, and this forum still has a rich pay-streak. Even with all the bluster, AA's posts and videos are informative and yield some great tips that will put $$ into peoples pockets, methinks some of the 'tude just reminds us of someone else.................. And that isn't AA's fault that we're sensitive to that. I hope he wises up and "tones" (see what I did there...?) down his delivery for the betterment of himself, his product, this forum, and maybe even the industry to some extent....

Kudo's to DTD, Frog and the others for managing to keep their cool, when many others of us would have preferred to see the button pushed to protect the sanctuary here. I suspect they see value in the videos and the HSB approach and because of that have turned the other cheek to a certain extent.

It ain't easy to be a Mod/Admin sometimes.

[Inkworks]

Here, just to lighten the mood, Ice-out Fishing with the kids this year in Beautiful British Columbia:

[Command-Z]

Has it gotten so bad that even Lemorris is considering leaving?

Darth Vader NO!

[starchild]

Ok guys.. On this post this was totally my fault..

This is what happened- We all know emotions run high when it comes to Tom's posts and because of this he feels the heat.
So when Tom started this post the subject line was- Why you should not separate in PhotoShop channels. It was immediately
edited to what you see know.

That kinda got under my skin (all things being relevant) that he was being kicked.  I feel (Why you should not print plastisol transfers with straight regular plastisol ink) is a good subject starter and goes without saying that it's an "opinion".  Anyways I left it alone and let Tom do what he do- share his vision and passion with others. (There was a bit of disappointment in Tom his post subject being edited though).

The following day I responded to a link he posted for comparison to the amount of work you have to do in PS channels, compared to using the techniques he suggest (in his opinion). That link was edited/removed/gone before my page was refreshed from posting my reply.  And I just felt I had to say something. Yes I kinda exaggerated that MySeps uses 12-14 colors for jobs (for effect purposes) to try and get my point across but still no one said starr you're an ass.. It was let's bash the Tom agenda and it just escalated from there.

Frog and Dan explained the reasoning for removing the link however.

I personally don't trust the- he's working tirelessly on videos just to sell simple seps to us and convert us- agenda. The program is way too cheap for all that effort. So maybe in his opinion there is value in using HSB in Corel to separate and he wants the industry to be aware of this. (I've used Jeff's model of HSB sep in PS and to just do the hue reveal is a lot of layer blending and layer management) Besides, we are like what 2000 members strong? What's the conversion rate on that? 15% B2B? When there are hundreds of thousands of screen printers world wide. Then that's just bad business. He'll do better with a mailing list.

Again guys, this was my bad. And I apologize.

[Inkworks]

I don't think anyone denies Tom's passion for what he's doing, it comes through in spades otherwise he'd have long ago have been dismissed.

It's tough to see the reason behind edits and deletions sometimes, they are often due to historic problems online, and that isn't readily apparent if you aren't aware of the whole back-story.

I can't speak for the guys running the show here, but I'd bet they'd much rather have inquiries about board content, deletions and edits dealt with via PM or e-mail.

Trying to explain the minutia of why Mod. decisions were made online is just opening the door for people to nit-pick those decisions and use them as precedents in other cases.

Ultimately, they can delete, edit, or ban for whatever reason they want here, or for no reason at all if they wish, ......but they have to walk a fine line or people will vote with their feet. So far they've done a bang-up job as evidenced by the popularity of this forum and the quality of submissions.


Top all that off with the fact that you can't please all the people all the time. I haven't seen a forum yet where somebody doesn't post a "well I'm outta here" once in a while, it comes with the territory, and the bigger and more popular a forum becomes, the more you'll see that.

Doris Day - Que Sera Sera

[Dottonedan]

Bottome line is:

Tom and Co. Is/will be valuable to many, hopefully thousands of people here at our forum. We are just very serious about keeping it clean and maybe he's been under a microscope with me while here and I may have been quick to keep his use of words in line. He's been doing great with some very good threads. His initial entrence here was a bit over the top a few weeks ago (a few times) and I think he knows the ground rules now. Outside of a few hiccups, he has been a great contribution. He's a little quirky at times, but aren't we all occasionally?

Passionate or not, we all need to try and not offend others. We should stay consistant with providing a level headed two sided post ( unless your are in the cage) and then it can get wild...but you know that going in.

Here, out in the open, we want to learn and grow, without the negativity you can find elsewhere.
This is why we prefer competitors of a product to discuss pros and cons (with the other competitor knowing about it) and having the ability to state their side. Simple as that. That's all.

Tom had been doing well in this thread and I encourage him to continue to find interest in contributing here. We may just need to accept a little bit of his eyebrow raising pops now and then and I will ask him in a PM if I need to address anything with him, assuming his passion may push him to slip now and then.

Outside of all of that, lets continue with the HSB questions.

Thanks
Dan

[AdvancedArtist]

Let me share a story with you...

Christmas eve 2009 I get an email from a man in South Africa..

Mr Tom I want thank you this night my family have the best dinner ever for the Christmas. Because you teach me how work the Corel for my t-shirt business. I no can pay your products but you teach me to make success. Merry Christmas Mr Tom.

Now some of you would say I am this and that.. but that is my life I know they are out there and will correct and I will teach with or without mercy because if you are poor I will teach you. So you can rail on me but those people and all of us need this understanding.

So judge me but before you do walk in my shoes.

[Dottonedan]

I don't think anyone wants to judge you. We would simply like for you to continue as you have been and simply post educational stuff.  I'm sure as we go, we may all come to realize and see the true you. The more kinder, gentler you that you really are. It just takes some time to get past old things for many people. The more we let old things lay and die, the less we hear of them and can move forward.


Thanks for your contributions.


D

[AdvancedArtist]

Thanks Dan  Lets let the old things go by the way side..