Process or Sim Process?

[IntegrityShirts]

That is the question.  Cost is a main concern.  Going on Ash tees.  I think I need to get more opaque process inks from Union. My trutone set works ok on whites but I am always struggling to get enough ink down in my opinion.  Any tips?  I usually end up double stroking a color or two to get enough gain to blend well.

[Socalfmf]

we like simprocess better than true process...but we do a lot of it...so i would go with that...and double stroke...no way...get your systems down and rock those shirts..

sam

[ScreenFoo]

I'd do 4-c--although the green might be a candidate for a bump plate if they're picky.  Oh, right, price--no bump for them.   

Union's 3x tru-tone inks have treated me pretty well.
I've done some natural tees with a white wet on wet, as well as halftoned underbases on black and gotten some nice results with it.  It's transparent--you still have to underbase just right--but you have more wiggle room if you want to base it back.  I wouldn't worry about neutral shirt color with a white screen, especially ash...

[IntegrityShirts]

Think I'm going to pick up some of the Union 3X inks, mine are just the regular and that's exactly what I'm afraid to do, base them back to get them to print with one stroke, for fear of really fubar-ing the color mix.  They need a little more oomph, so I think the 3X will fit nicely, thank!

There are a couple other spot colors at the bottom to throw into the cost.  No green though!  So you're saying, ymck +top white wet on wet on ash right?  That's what I was thinking at least.  These are construction company tees for new project launches etc so almost throw-aways in terms of the end recipients which is why cost is such a big deal to them.

[ScreenFoo]

Ohhhh no.  You shouldn't have any problems getting them in one stroke--although I cheat on black shirts, just to combat the dot piling from a flashed halftoned underbase--again, if your underbase tones are right, the color is the easy part.

If you have color balance issues on press, you can add some halftone base if one of the colors is too 'hot'--in a perfect world this wouldn't happen.  If that's where you're at, invite me to visit some time.    

And I really need to try Unions halftone white--right now I use a half softhand half white ink mix, and I put it first in order-- wymck  it also helps control dot gain.  (Kudos to Mark Coudray on that one)
I haven't done any super long runs like this however--if you're doing thousands, I'd definitely look into their process white, as I haven't had any 200+ orders to see if build-up is an issue.  YMMV.

[IntegrityShirts]

Cool thanks.  I'm going to try out the 3x kit in quarts and see how it does.  So on lights like ash you print the highlight white first with no flash?  Never considered printing the "highlight white" first, but I see your point.

What ink do you use when you underbase on darks?  I just did a run of black shirts with underbase qcm 158 with a bit of softee added and I think if I had had the 3X inks it would have popped more than it did.  It wasn't bad and the customer liked it, but I'm always looking for perfect lol.

[ScreenFoo]

I do a lightness channel screen, not a highlight.  As for white, I've used diamond and 711 with softhand, but I've been meaning to try out some non-low bleed whites, but then again, like I said, I should try Unions HT white too.

With that kind of image, I'd probably do a highlight white last too, after a flash.  White car, and the areas on the buildings that are really light would probably benefit.   
I'd point out too, I'd love to do stuff like this sim or index, but with only eight heads that kinda thing doesn't work so well...

[RICK STEFANICK]

I'd do 4-c--although the green might be a candidate for a bump plate if they're picky.  Oh, right, price--no bump for them.   

Union's 3x tru-tone inks have treated me pretty well.
I've done some natural tees with a white wet on wet, as well as halftoned underbases on black and gotten some nice results with it.  It's transparent--you still have to underbase just right--but you have more wiggle room if you want to base it back.  I wouldn't worry about neutral shirt color with a white screen, especially ash...

yep, those 3x process colors are killer. i agree with the green spot plate also. 4c process will work great on that if the seps are great.

[mk162]

I would go sim plus a white.  Dan is really good at knocking things down to fit our press.

Or outsource it to pierre and get back a perfect print.  I did that with a job I couldn't have printed on my own.  Customer LOVED them.

[IntegrityShirts]

Thanks guys.  I will probably utilize Dan at some point on either this one or the next one that has a little more time to work with.  I have a 10 color but dedicated flash in station two so 9 printable heads, or 8 if I need to flash again with the IR panel somewhere in between.  If I have time I'm going to try to test the 3x inks with this art for "fun".

Question though.  Do you guys flash your base white on light color tees before printing top colors?  Seems like I read somewhere that some people do and some don't.  I always have but wasn't sure of the results if I didn't.  Guess I could test that too.

I also have a dual cure emulsion coming as the aquasol hv may be exposing a little fast and creeping in on my screens.

[Dottonedan]

Funny thing is, I think I separated that same building and art for a guy about 3-4 years ago. The art was a tad different. Not sectioned off like different photo's but all one digital file. When you are ready, send it on over.

Thanks
Dan

[RICK STEFANICK]

Thanks guys.  I will probably utilize Dan at some point on either this one or the next one that has a little more time to work with.  I have a 10 color but dedicated flash in station two so 9 printable heads, or 8 if I need to flash again with the IR panel somewhere in between.  If I have time I'm going to try to test the 3x inks with this art for "fun".

Question though.  Do you guys flash your base white on light color tees before printing top colors?  Seems like I read somewhere that some people do and some don't.  I always have but wasn't sure of the results if I didn't.  Guess I could test that too.

I also have a dual cure emulsion coming as the aquasol hv may be exposing a little fast and creeping in on my screens.

good choice on the dual cure for process work. the extra exposure time is well worth the result with designs like this. I would get mr. campbell to separate it and print that baby yourself. For goodness sake your a screen printer. I wouldnt even consider contracting it out unless you didnt have a auto. 

[IntegrityShirts]

Ok, so tight deadline as I got distracted with other jobs this week and neglected to send it to Dan.  I promise to utilize you next time I print something like this!  They came out nice with one hiccup.  The magenta ink was giving me fits with it's consistency on press.  One print would be heavy, next would be lighter and it really affected the shadows.  Only thing I can attribute it to is the ink viscosity was way thinner than the other inks or maybe the way I had to have that head's depth set to print.  Once the pallets heated up they may have changed heights affecting pressure of the print.  Client wanted the logos on the bottom with a white background, which makes it really hard to hold detail when printing top colors so there's a tiny bit of bleed out that you don't notice unless you reeeeally get close.

Another bummer was the ink.  I received my Union box over a week ago for the 3X inks, opened it up to ink up the screens and it's not the 3X kit, but some pthalate free sample kit of some sort so I had to print with my regular Union process inks.

7 colors: white, flash, yellow, magenta, cyan, black, flash, spot blue, spot maroon.  I exposed a green bump screen but didn't use it after testing a few and seeing how bright the green grass came out.

Cell phone pic which was way too dark so I lightened it up in photoshop to get it closer to real life.

[Dottonedan]

I can't say that it's a bad job. It's a little funky in some areas and much of that might be due to the photo taken.  Over all, it's a pertty dern good job. With a better  "real photo from a camera", we could really tell more but as it is, I'd say you did a good job on it. Especially if the customer was pleased.

[IntegrityShirts]

Thanks Dan.  I really do want to get these prints down to a science so they aren't so nerve-racking.  The yellow was run a little hot to make the green grass pop which worked out ok, but I think if you had done the seps you could have done that a better way.  I need to address the head that was printing magenta.  I had to use the actual depth stoppers on the choppers and run the air pressure up higher on that head because the flood valve wouldn't actuate consistently below 30psi.  Which meant I couldn't run the maroon on air pressure only like the other colors.

What is your normal process for sepping?  Should I proof the art and layout to the customer and then send it to you once they approve?  I'd just hate to have to revise something after the fact, in this case the white background around the logos wasn't planned.