Permanent Ghosting

[lancasterprinthouse]

Been grabbing answer off this board for a while now so thanks for all the info!

I have an issue I cant seem to solve and have searched for answers and kind find anything specific to what I have going on. I have permanent ghosting that I can't seem to get off of my screens. Its the majority of my screens and it seems like each job leaves a new ghost. I print primarily water based and discharge and below are my steps from coating all the way through reclaim. I don't seem to have an issue with plastisol screens, just the WB and Discharge screens. MY average print run is 100-250 pieces at a time and could be anywhere from 1-6 colors. I am printing manually

Coat 1/1 on high mesh and 2/2 on 110/156 (white HSA WB)
Coated with Cryocoat (Saati PH, I believe)
Exposure on a Workhorse LED for 15-25 seconds depending on mesh/image
Spray with hose. I should note that in this step I have very high water pressure and just use a garden hose, not a pressure washer. I find that a pressure washre can sometimes take the image right out
Dry
Post Harden for 1 minute on the LED for long runs. 30 seconds for short runs
Tape and Print
Clean the screen with Fran Mar water based ink remover immediately after the run is over
Some screens sit for a few days before reclaim others get reclaimed right away. Just depends if I have my helper that day or not
After reclaim they air dry

I use Envriostrip for reclaim and do not use a dregreaser or dehazer. The only reason I do not use a dehazer is because it is a waste of chemicals. It does not work for me.

When printing, it IS hard for me to keep the ink moist throughout the long runs and I am often times misting my screens or removing the ink completely, returning to bucket and mixing in some water then putting back in the screen. I know I have a humidity issue in my shop and I need to correct that.

I attached some photos showing what I have going on. Are my screens underexposed from the gate? Would that be causing the ghosting? At first it wasn't an issue but as the ghost images build up, I can tell the ink deposit is uneven in my print even if you cant see it because my pallet has the same voids of run through ink that I see as ghost images on the screen.


Thanks for the help!

[Frog]

I use Envriostrip for reclaim and do not use a dregreaser or dehazer. The only reason I do not use a dehazer is because it is a waste of chemicals. It does not work for me.

Thanks for the help!

You got no effect from a dehazer? Which one(s) did you try?
I'd recommend CCI Liquid Renuit, and those screens should get a new life. Follow instructions because even with the less caustic versions, if they sit too long, damage can occur.

[RICK STEFANICK]

Under exposing is the source of the problem for sure. We went thru the exact issue here about a year ago. ICC 757 will get them clean but its really caustic and protective equipment is a must.

[tonypep]

Thats right Rick and.......it can bust the mesh if left on too long. My take on it is that that screen is locked up permanently

[RICK STEFANICK]

Thats right Rick and.......it can bust the mesh if left on too long. My take on it is that that screen is locked up permanently

It is really tough to get out. Tony, your correct about the downside of the 757 but nothing does what it does for extreme issues. We also have some Image Star pro-tex paste haze remover that worked adequate when left on longer and is not caustic.

[Stinkhorn Press]

Under exposing is the source of the problem for sure. We went thru the exact issue here about a year ago. ICC 757 will get them clean but its really caustic and protective equipment is a must.

I'm going to third that possibility.
our screens looked like that. at the time we didn't like pp emulsions (plastisol printer) and didn't yet have MH expo unit. haze removers don't do dick for this problem. well, eventually, enough times with the right stuff might dent it a bit, but not fixing the cause and it's going to come right back.

solution for us: easy reclaiming diazo emulsion (proclaim), don't over-coat, make sure emulsion/screen is DRY (30-40% humidity TOPS), 5000 KW MH expo (get a decent expo calc sheet) properly exposed, and our screens are easy to reclaim fully. Screens that have run 100 jobs look (almost) new.
you don't need our emulsion, but the right one for your needs helps.
coating is up to you, but it affects the exposure enormously. be consistent at the least.
humidity control is a MUST.
you don't need a MH expo, but you do need full and complete exposure.

[Squeegie]

The chemical of choice in our shop for any trouble screens, whether ghosting emulsion or ink stains, has been CCI GR-70.
I have left this on 300 mesh screens for almost 24 hrs and never had an issue.

I have reclaimed screens that have emulsion locked on due to forgetting them in the booth after spraying with emulsion remover.
I thought the mesh was finished...but got them looking good in short order.

[lancasterprinthouse]

I use Envriostrip for reclaim and do not use a dregreaser or dehazer. The only reason I do not use a dehazer is because it is a waste of chemicals. It does not work for me.

Thanks for the help!

You got no effect from a dehazer? Which one(s) did you try?
I'd recommend CCI Liquid Renuit, and those screens should get a new life. Follow instructions because even with the less caustic versions, if they sit too long, damage can occur.

I've tried quite a few. CCI Liquid Renuit was one of them. Franmar Dehaze and some really caustic ones from Easiway. None of them seamed to help.

[lancasterprinthouse]

Under exposing is the source of the problem for sure. We went thru the exact issue here about a year ago. ICC 757 will get them clean but its really caustic and protective equipment is a must.

I've been thinking under exposure was my problem especially because I have areas where the green from the emulsion is still on the screen and there wasn't even a print there. Its not locked in emulsion, just stained mesh from the emulsion. Any chance you're on LED? Trying to get a feel for what I should bump up to. I think I'll start at 40 seconds and see if that's too long. My most common mesh is 110, 195 and 230. Obviously I have many others but the majority are those 3 counts.

I haven't tried ICC 757 yet. I am hesitant to purchase another solution and just throw money away. I used EasiSolv 701 and EasiSolv 415 from Easiway and those are very caustic and they didn't do a darn thing, not a bit of difference. The mesh on these screens is still nice, aside from the ghosting and staining so I would love to get them back to new if possible. Maybe it is worth the couple bucks to try it out  because to remesh the 15 of so I have like this would be more expensive.

I got to the point where I started seperating my plastisol screens from my WB screens because I wanted to keep the nice ones I had nice and just reuse the same screens over and over for WB so I wasn't damaging all my screens.

Thanks!

[domineight]

Kiwo megakleen or Sericol dehaze paste, scrub that into that mesh with a squirt of lacquer thinner and it'll look brand new compared to what you have now.

Hows your waterblaster? a bit on the light side?

[lancasterprinthouse]

Kiwo megakleen or Sericol dehaze paste, scrub that into that mesh with a squirt of lacquer thinner and it'll look brand new compared to what you have now.

Hows your waterblaster? a bit on the light side?

My pressure washer is 1800psi. Not sure if thats considered light side but it definitely gets the job done.

[RICK STEFANICK]

Under exposing is the source of the problem for sure. We went thru the exact issue here about a year ago. ICC 757 will get them clean but its really caustic and protective equipment is a must.

I've been thinking under exposure was my problem especially because I have areas where the green from the emulsion is still on the screen and there wasn't even a print there. Its not locked in emulsion, just stained mesh from the emulsion. Any chance you're on LED? Trying to get a feel for what I should bump up to. I think I'll start at 40 seconds and see if that's too long. My most common mesh is 110, 195 and 230. Obviously I have many others but the majority are those 3 counts.

I haven't tried ICC 757 yet. I am hesitant to purchase another solution and just throw money away. I used EasiSolv 701 and EasiSolv 415 from Easiway and those are very caustic and they didn't do a darn thing, not a bit of difference. The mesh on these screens is still nice, aside from the ghosting and staining so I would love to get them back to new if possible. Maybe it is worth the couple bucks to try it out  because to remesh the 15 of so I have like this would be more expensive.

I got to the point where I started seperating my plastisol screens from my WB screens because I wanted to keep the nice ones I had nice and just reuse the same screens over and over for WB so I wasn't damaging all my screens.

Thanks!

I bet if you called ICC they would send you a free sample. I think may require you to pay shipping because it is Hazardous. I promise you have never used a de-haze this caustic. Its real nasty stuff but 15-20 years ago It was the norm in many shops. Please wear a face shield

[Frog]

Under exposing is the source of the problem for sure. We went thru the exact issue here about a year ago. ICC 757 will get them clean but its really caustic and protective equipment is a must.

I've been thinking under exposure was my problem especially because I have areas where the green from the emulsion is still on the screen and there wasn't even a print there. Its not locked in emulsion, just stained mesh from the emulsion. Any chance you're on LED? Trying to get a feel for what I should bump up to. I think I'll start at 40 seconds and see if that's too long. My most common mesh is 110, 195 and 230. Obviously I have many others but the majority are those 3 counts.

I haven't tried ICC 757 yet. I am hesitant to purchase another solution and just throw money away. I used EasiSolv 701 and EasiSolv 415 from Easiway and those are very caustic and they didn't do a darn thing, not a bit of difference. The mesh on these screens is still nice, aside from the ghosting and staining so I would love to get them back to new if possible. Maybe it is worth the couple bucks to try it out  because to remesh the 15 of so I have like this would be more expensive.

I got to the point where I started seperating my plastisol screens from my WB screens because I wanted to keep the nice ones I had nice and just reuse the same screens over and over for WB so I wasn't damaging all my screens.

Thanks!

I bet if you called ICC they would send you a free sample. I think may require you to pay shipping because it is Hazardous. I promise you have never used a de-haze this caustic. Its real nasty stuff but 15-20 years ago It was the norm in many shops. Please wear a face shield

Probably a safe bet with this poster, but is it stronger than this stuff? (which they just made even stronger with a new version adding the word "Extra".

[RICK STEFANICK]

Probably in the same ballpark.

[abchung]

I use Macdermid auto-strip powder and their emulsion. But will never use their auto haze again.... auto haze  ripped so many of my screens.... quickest rip... 7secs after applying...

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