80,000 white shirts flash or no flash.

[Dottonedan]

 I've re-separated a job to print with better production
 the two heaviest screens heaviest ink content I put in the end of the print order.

The black screen is a typical simulated process sep  with no solid areas all halftone.

This is a white T-shirt printed  seven color simple process for 80,000 units.
 The two people in charge of production want to flash the black screen and print it first. I've already lightened it so that it can print at the end of my light blue and dark blue and mix with this two.

 They suggested I change it and I've done this type of printing thousands of times at the shop so I've worked at for large quantities but I think I have a bigger problem here with the way they know to print.

 So my question is for 80,000 (white) shirts even if the halftone black separation has been lightened back for gain and intended to blend with the blue and black should I change it to  have the black first and flash it on a white shirt? L

I figure that there is very rarely an occasion to flash on a white shirt  if the steps have been done right… And they have…  I'm giving them the benefit of the doubt and assuming that the number of times that they would have to wipe the screens down at the end of the print sequence for black would be more than the time invested in flashing up front??

 I can only guess that because it's 80,000 that they think that
it will pick up and become too light to many times in the production run so they want to keep the black up front and flashed.

 What are your thoughts?

[Doug S]

I've never had the experience to print 80,000 prints but with wilflex black on a couple of thousand the print has stayed consistent after the first 15 or so prints through the rest of the run especially on white.  There is a far cry's difference in 2000 and 80000 though.

[Orion]

Let them do it their way to get the job out. Later you all can go back and review how it ran and discuss if your seps would have run better.
You are the new kid on the block it will be a while before you can get everything printing "your way". I had the same problem when I took over at Transgraphics....

[blue moon]

agreed with Orion! Your job now is to observe and document. Make sure they understand that and that you will be implementing changes after the assessment. Make sure you document how long it takes to produce that order (as mentioned already, it's what you should be doing now) so you can compare it to your results later.

pierre

[tonypep]

A consideration....process black. Whats the difference? Primarily pigment grind..Wash test no matter what

[jsheridan]

I'll do what ever I need to on press to run 80k shirts in a very timely and productive manner. if that means flashing the black or what, then so be it.

[Frog]

And, please document with pics some of the end products, and your pre-press differences. A visual comparo could be valuable for all. (this assumes that you are not bound to secrecy as Tony was)

[Sbrem]

It would depend on the art actually, but generally we wouldn't flash on white. I would tend to think that would slow it down a second or so, and for 80K that could add up. But as Pierre said, let them run it the way they know, and work with them later...

Steve

[jvanick]

we run a flash on almost every job (even if it's just for 1/2 a second).. warm platens keep the glue stickier longer.  I'm along the camp of whatever gets the job out the door quicker with the most consistent results.

[3Deep]

Agree let them rock the way they been rocking and make changes on smaller jobs and work your way up, you don't need pissed off printers before you can get rooted in.

[Colin]

You have given us your mechanical reasons for printing it your way.

I would ask them for the mechanical reasons why they want to print it their way.  There could be several reasons why "their way" works the best in your shop currently.  Anything from ink selection/ink opacities/current dot gain/in house wash testing/customers wash testing/etc...

I see both options as being viable for different reasons.

I personally like to have a flash, like others have said, to keep the boards warm and the glue sticky.  Assuming waterbase tack of course.

Maybe you can add your black screen at the end of the run to show them what it would be like?

[Sbrem]

You have given us your mechanical reasons for printing it your way.

I would ask them for the mechanical reasons why they want to print it their way.  There could be several reasons why "their way" works the best in your shop currently.  Anything from ink selection/ink opacities/current dot gain/in house wash testing/customers wash testing/etc...

I see both options as being viable for different reasons.

I personally like to have a flash, like others have said, to keep the boards warm and the glue sticky.  Assuming waterbase tack of course.

Maybe you can add your black screen at the end of the run to show them what it would be like?

"Keep the boards sticky" I get, but even in a New England weather it's never below 85° in our shop, or so it seems anyway...

Steve

[jsheridan]

"Keep the boards sticky" I get, but even in a New England weather it's never below 85° in our shop, or so it seems anyway...

The glue seems to work best in the 100ish range or so and a 'courtesy' flash on whites helps with ink pick up later in the run.

Black flashes fast, like really fast so it won't slow the press down. This 80k will build up ink on the black screen no matter what so hitting it first and flashing, is exactly what I would do.. even if my artist told me he wants to print it last.

[3Deep]

If I had the press size I'd flash all color before the black even went down, as I use black as my trap color a lot here, not much trap but just a little, I can see why they would want to use black in the run first.

[DannyGruninger]

Can only speak for what I would do.....

I rarely ever(close to never) run black first..... We run black on our last head if the highlight white in front of it is a small area, if the white has large areas black then goes right in front of top white.

On white garments we print small to big wet on wet, flash before black which would print last.


If the art has solid black AND black halftone for 80k garments we are running two black screens, 1 with solid and halftone, and 1 solid areas only. That way we can control the halftone better and still get a deep solid black.


Good luck with the new gig and getting them to change. I've found that "change" is a very scary scenario for most printers