finding a standard

[AAMike]

I am trying to create a standard lpi angle and dot shape for output on our wasatch rip and dts. Currently we rip 65lpi 22.5 and dot as the shape. The underbase white halftone is set to 45 lpi and 22.5 (sometimes). Yesterday one of the race car designs had an almost crosshatch like appearance in the halftones on the shirt. After some heavy reading last night here and other places, I had them rip the job across the board 60 lpi 22.5 elliptical dot. The mesh is 305. Wasatch seems to have some hybrid dot shape that transitions to a stochastic in the highlight and shadow content. Has anyone experimented with the hybrid dot?

[SEPSINK]

Never really strayed from the elliptical dot on this end.

[blue moon]

as you noticed, the ubase and top colors have to be at the same lpi. If your output is calibrated, physical limitations of the mesh are 55lpi on the standard 305. You can do slightly better on thin thread.

hybrid dot is a good idea in principle, but I've heard from few ppl that it is not working as well in practice. I would imagine that if no ubase is needed, it would still be great. Once you dial in your settings maybe you can let us know what you find out.

pierre

[mk162]

pierre, you limit 55 on 305?  That is what we use on 230's and can usually eek out a bit higher than that without problems.

305 should hold 65 no problem in most cases.

[Colin]

Pierre might be looking at getting full resolution of his smallest dots as he does a lot of very high end sim-process work.

His rip is also calibrated to represent dots properly.

For myself, with a non calibrated 4880 printer.  I run everything at 60 lpi with 225 S mesh for my base with 270 or 330 top colors depending on detail levels.

When you look at the screens under magnification, you still get some threads clipping the dots, but with good eom on the thin threads you can still get ink to deposit around the threads.

[jvanick]

Pierre and Dan are right on with the math.

We go for the art, and what the end result looks like...

While I care about the math, and the theory, the end result is what matters most to me

Shoot your 225S at 75lpi and check the results, if you're OK losing the ends of the range, you may be very happy with your results.

Case in point: serj does some amazing work at 100+ lpi on 305 mesh... same thing with Artem in Turkey...

[blue moon]

if the output is not calibrated we are talking apples to oranges. Most of the uncalibrated output I've seen seems to be off by 10 lpi. So what Colin might be calling 60lpi would equate to our 50lpi. Or in other words, our 55lpi would equal his 65lpi.

unless we are talking about calibrated output, SERJ's 100lpi could actually be 70 lpi! So it's hard to compare notes if we are not talking the same language.

also to consider, as I understand, full range of dots (3-95%) is only possible at 55lpi on the standard(T) 305 mesh. We can hold 3% on the 330S mesh which has much thinner mesh. 5% or so seems to be our limit on 305T. This means the dots smaller than 15% or so get lost if we print at 100lpi. If we separate the artwork so there are no dots smaller than 15% than we can print 100lpi. the reality is that the 15% 100lpi dot is about equivalent in size to the, lets say, 3% 55lpi dot! . SERJ is probably adjusting his seps to compensate for it and is making it work!

I've done the making it work part and unfortunately it bit me in the behind pretty bad. As time goes on output devices change and unless you are linearized, you will have to compensate and adjust your new device to print the same wrong dots. Trying to chase that down can be pretty tough. Sticking with the proper settings makes the life easier in the long run.

pierre

[Sbrem]

Personally, I've never been able to run two line counts without serious moire patterns...

Steve

[AAMike]

I just looked at the screens at 60lpi and elliptical dots 22.5 on 305 and it looks pretty smooth compared to yesterdays effort. It will be on press this afternoon.

[AAMike]

Turns out, we burned the screens on 355's. The job came out great at 60lpi and 22.5, elliptical dot.  i wish I could show the results on this one but it is for the Daytona race and I simply can't. Thanks for the input guys.


Mike Hoey
Director of Embellishment
MJ Soffe

[blue moon]

Turns out, we burned the screens on 355's. The job came out great at 60lpi and 22.5, elliptical dot.  i wish I could show the results on this one but it is for the Daytona race and I simply can't. Thanks for the input guys.


Mike Hoey
Director of Embellishment
MJ Soffe

you could just do a close up!

pierre

[Colin]

if the output is not calibrated we are talking apples to oranges. Most of the uncalibrated output I've seen seems to be off by 10 lpi. So what Colin might be calling 60lpi would equate to our 50lpi. Or in other words, our 55lpi would equal his 65lpi.

pierre

Double checked the lines per inch at 60 lpi in a one inch square.  Its 60

Now % dot size...  I know that's not correct   But it's not very far off either.

[AAMike]

I will scan a section side by side in the morning

-m

[AAMike]

Here is a shot scanned on our color photo copier. Please note that this was still out of register on this first strike of but the patterns were gone

[Dottonedan]

if the output is not calibrated we are talking apples to oranges. Most of the uncalibrated output I've seen seems to be off by 10 lpi. So what Colin might be calling 60lpi would equate to our 50lpi. Or in other words, our 55lpi would equal his 65lpi.

unless we are talking about calibrated output, SERJ's 100lpi could actually be 70 lpi! So it's hard to compare notes if we are not talking the same language.

also to consider, as I understand, full range of dots (3-95%) is only possible at 55lpi on the standard(T) 305 mesh. We can hold 3% on the 330S mesh which has much thinner mesh. 5% or so seems to be our limit on 305T. This means the dots smaller than 15% or so get lost if we print at 100lpi. If we separate the artwork so there are no dots smaller than 15% than we can print 100lpi. the reality is that the 15% 100lpi dot is about equivalent in size to the, lets say, 3% 55lpi dot! . SERJ is probably adjusting his seps to compensate for it and is making it work!

I've done the making it work part and unfortunately it bit me in the behind pretty bad. As time goes on output devices change and unless you are linearized, you will have to compensate and adjust your new device to print the same wrong dots. Trying to chase that down can be pretty tough. Sticking with the proper settings makes the life easier in the long run.

pierre

That Pierre guy, he catches on.   Get your dot in shape...you will emmm. "YODA".