is that as good as it gets with a Kornit DTG?

[Rockers]

Just got some samples back from a DTG shop for one of our clients. We had to sample 5 designs of which 4 were screen printed by us and one we had to outsource for DTG. The shop that did that for us used one of the newest Kornit printers for that. I had really high expectations but the result in the end was rather disappointing. Which makes me wonder if they don`t know how to operate that machine, or if the company that sets them up for the shops does not know how to do that proper. Honestly if that is the best result you can get with a Kornit then I would rather buy something else with that money.

the attached photo shows the top shirt screen printed and the bottom one DTG with pre treatment of course.

[CSPGarrett]

Start with basics.  What brand of shirt and style. If ringspun and 100% cotton the white should be bright white.  As bright as screen printing?  That can be debated, but they should be near similar to your average consumer.  The dtg print of course will have a different hand.  Also Kornit prints a bit different than dupont machines, you may want to reach out to another printer with a different machine.

If the shirt is just a G5000 or something similar the print should be white but won't "pop" as much/often since the surface doesn't hold the ink just as well.

[kingscreen]

Definitely not right.  I've seen Kornit prints that took very close inspection to determine it wasn't a screen print.  I'd venture to say that any DTG Whire should look better than that.

[3Deep]

I just got a sample from the Kornit DTG machine a few weeks ago and it look great very bright colors even after a few washes it's still looks good.  I'd say they done something wrong in there color setting's...

[cbjamel]

Is it possible its on poly t.
Grey ink color makes me wonder or they did not do the right setting.
Shane

[Rockers]

Is it possible its on poly t.
Grey ink color makes me wonder or they did not do the right setting.
Shane

These are 100% cotton tees. No poly at all.
What they have produced is such a mess.

[TCred]

Hey Rockers,

We have a Kornit machine. If I amreading you right, the grey one is the DTG? If so then for sure there is something wrong. It could be from a lot of sources ranging from file to shirt to pre-treat to ink settings. Hard to tell without being on site.

What I can say for sure is that absolutely opaque whites are not hard to achieve.

For comparison (you can show them the pics as evidence if you like) below is a job that we printed recently.

[BorisB]

Is it possible its on poly t.
Grey ink color makes me wonder or they did not do the right setting.
Shane

These are 100% cotton tees. No poly at all.
What they have produced is such a mess.

Most likely it's printshop lack of:
-knowledge,
-or readiness to test settings for your shirts, if new to them
-or having poor drying tunnel
-or being too "geizig" because white costs about 1,00$ per properly executed print like this.

Or combination of above reasons.

We don't print that crapy, even on cheap blends. We spend more ink, even loose money sometimes, but this shouldn't leeave shop. It's not Kornit, it's operaters.

[Rockers]

Hey Rockers,

We have a Kornit machine. If I amreading you right, the grey one is the DTG? If so then for sure there is something wrong. It could be from a lot of sources ranging from file to shirt to pre-treat to ink settings. Hard to tell without being on site.

What I can say for sure is that absolutely opaque whites are not hard to achieve.

For comparison (you can show them the pics as evidence if you like) below is a job that we printed recently.

All I can say is it looks like you know how to operate your Kornit DTG, something I can`t say about most DTG shops over here. I think it`s because the distributer for most DTG machines here has no clue either how to set them up proper. Quick question, are there different setting you can choose from, like for full color prints or spot color only prints etc?

[TCred]

The white ink controls differ slightly between models and their associated RIP, however basically they can use two white layers or one for white areas, and then there are controls for how much white is applied under "dark" or "light" colours. On top of all that the total amount of white can be controlled.

It's not rocket science but like screen printing you have to test each shirt because the amount of pre-treatment used will affect the print a lot, as well as the suitability of the shirt for the Kornit inks. For example a Gildan 5000 is hopeless with Kornit inks. Combed cotton is a must, ring spun in our experience (which to be honest is limited) just doesn't work with Kornit inks. Other DTG systems using Dupont inks however are OK with ring spun. Test Test test...... is the order of the day.

Don't let them fob you off, the results can and should be amazing.

We had to learn the hard way, basically after a bit of basic "this button does that" we had to figure it out for ourselves. Lots of rags later we are getting saleable product, but it was not without heartache.

[mk162]

I've not heard good things about Kornit's training.  The machines are killer, but they really need to improve that end.

is anybody making any aftermarket pretreats for the Kornit?  I've been playing with some on the brother and I am very impressed with how well we can print on some troublesome shirts.

Gildans are getting much better, still not perfect though.  We tend to work with Jerzees, Hanes, Fruit and Port mainly.

[BorisB]

Hey Rockers,

We have a Kornit machine. If I amreading you right, the grey one is the DTG? If so then for sure there is something wrong. It could be from a lot of sources ranging from file to shirt to pre-treat to ink settings. Hard to tell without being on site.

What I can say for sure is that absolutely opaque whites are not hard to achieve.

For comparison (you can show them the pics as evidence if you like) below is a job that we printed recently.

All I can say is it looks like you know how to operate your Kornit DTG, something I can`t say about most DTG shops over here. I think it`s because the distributer for most DTG machines here has no clue either how to set them up proper. Quick question, are there different setting you can choose from, like for full color prints or spot color only prints etc?

We are not that good.  To produce top results you would need to test and work with chosen styles only. As a contract printer you don't get such luxury.

you control white rather similar to screen printing.
-One pass, or double.
-Highlight over white in %
-you set different percentage of white under light/dark color, in %
-amount of spray is even more important:
  -too little, white ink is absorbed by shirt too much  (like too much pressure in screen printing)
  -too much and white ink bleeds/dissolves into spray "puddle"

[Dottonedan]

AS you know with nay product/equipment, it's only as good as you put into it.  Sure, there are products better than others but especially with DTG, you need to have someone operating it that is "print savvy" and semi operational savvy.  A shop can be trained great on how to use equipment but once the trainer  leaves it can be anyone's guess as to who and how many are operating that same machine. As people get trained on down the line, info gets lost.

Two great things to remember about getting new equipment (even if) you are already experienced at the machine or been running one for years,

1, When anyone gets trained on something, it's always a good idea to video tape it for review and training others.

2, Always have multiple people being trained.

When it's a mom and pop shop, they typically pay good attention and do very well. When an owner has very few people to rely on, they do very well since they need to focus and have a goal of getting the best prints and are able to operate more consistently. When you have more and more employees, some may not share the same excitement for image accuracy or training/information gets lost.

The business of DTG with any brand can be more challenging for some people. It can be difficult if you don't stay on top of every phase/step of the process to do DTG.  Temp, pre-treat amount, garment type, file setup, ink coverage, etc.   This is a contributor to why some shops that offer DTG are not consistent in image/print quality and others are.  It's all in what you put into it.

[Frog]

Not to knock Brandt and his offer to be cranking out stuff for members next week with his newly acquired machine(s), but I hope that he is reading this thread and perhaps adjusting his timeline.

[mk162]

I will say the brother folks did get us confident on the machine before they left.  It's a pretty brainless thing to operate...the hard part is getting the PT right.

I didn't like the settings the tech recommended.  I can print faster with the same vividness printing 600 dpi.

Brandt should be good to go, but I would play around for a week or two before selling any white ink jobs just to get comfortable.