Print order on this logo?

[Wildcard]

This hardly compares to the radical separations discussions elsewhere on the forum (hence Newbie section), but I figure there will be some differing opinions.

I have a logo print with a color combination that could be printed in a number of different sequences and I'm interested in some opinions from the pro's: Grey (11C), white and orange (715C) printed onto hi-vis orange cotton twill shirt. I'm questioning the normal process of printing lightest to darkest here. Instead of printing white (underbase)>orange>grey, I'm thinking that the grey works better as a base with the white under the orange. I figure the grey will have a softer hand than a full white underbase and still provide a platform for the white and orange to gain opacity.
I'm undecided whether printing orange>white as wet on wet would get an opaque orange over the grey base and save me a bunch of flash cycles. Also wondering if the small text would be best printed last (in white), or as a knockout color with the orange printed last. Other considerations: only 43 shirt order so its going on the manual press and I've invoiced for 3 screen setup only.

Or perhaps the white should print first but only under the orange>flash>orange>grey as wet on wet... and so my head goes in cycles over the simplest little 3 color logo.

James

[DannyGruninger]

4 screens and two flashes...

1. Grey(as its own screen/not underbasing anything)
2. Underbase white(under the orange and top white)

Flash

3. Orange

Flash

4. Highlight white

That's how I'd run this one but plenty of other ways to do it.

[Screened Gear]

43 shirts. I would do a white and orange screen. White would be the underbase and showing top white. Choke the the part that is white. Print the white flash white flash orange.

Don't complicate the easy jobs. Plus for 48 shirts having a stand alone underbase adds time to the job at 48 shirts. (Making the screen, lineup, inking, taking down the s teen and reclaim.

There is no Grey in the design right...if your printing the background Grey that would be the first screen down no underbase the flash .

[Wildcard]

@Danny - Not sure I can see how the grey + white as a wet on wet print would work out, seems like a recipe for a mess? Maybe I'm confused.

@ScreenedGear - The grey box is definitely a part of the logo. Whole logo to be printed onto orange fabric (but not the same orange as the logo, so it needs its own ink). What I'm getting from your post is: grey box>flash>white (with choke under orange)>flash>orange. As you say I'm trying to avoid unnecessary screens or flashes for the small order quantity.

[willy35]

Can't you replace the orange 715C with the crap color ? hi-vis orange cotton twill shirt.

Then if the customer agree, grey, white, flash white again

[Wildcard]

Can't you replace the orange 715C with the crap color ? hi-vis orange cotton twill shirt.

Then if the customer agree, grey, white, flash white again

Ha! This was my first offer to them and I obviously offered a better price on the 2 color print, but they really want that logo orange correct.

[willy35]

Then I will do

1. Grey - 230 or 305 - based down ink, to ease wet on wet, me I use mixopak ink and I add 50% chino base.

2. white underbase

flash

3. white underbase again

Flash

4. orange

[mooseman]

We hate printing orange (plastisol) as it never seems to cover on darker shirts or bases to our satisfaction .
A white underbase always helps eliminate PFPFPFPFPF work.
A side note check the spacing of the letters EA , looks like the "A" needs a little nudge to the East?
mooseman

[Colin]

 My Shop, my parameters....

1) 180 mesh - Grey

2) 150s mesh - White Base - .5 Choke for orange overlap

-Flash-

Smoothing Screen - this helps soooooooo much

3) 180 mesh - Orange.  I use Rutlands mixing system so I would create an opaque white base plate version.

-Flash-

4) 180 Mesh - White Highlite

We will ALWAYS do a white highlite screen.

1) It smooths out the edges of the other colors that wick out/get fuzzy.  With smaller text you run the risk of it becoming illegible without it.

2) Makes for a thinner better feeling print.

When printing the grey and white base wet on wet you need to make sure you are not laying down a TON of ink.  Just enough to allow the ink to get into the shirt when stepped on by the white base.  We also choke the white base to assist with the grey ink spreading a touch. 

With our printing the hand would be very soft and still very bright.

Other shops would prefer to print their white base through a higher mesh count, which is perfectly fine within their shops parameters.

My 2 cents.

[DannyGruninger]

My Shop, my parameters....

1) 180 mesh - Grey

2) 150s mesh - White Base - .5 Choke for orange overlap

-Flash-

Smoothing Screen - this helps soooooooo much

3) 180 mesh - Orange.  I use Rutlands mixing system so I would create an opaque white base plate version.

-Flash-

4) 180 Mesh - White Highlite

We will ALWAYS do a white highlite screen.

1) It smooths out the edges of the other colors that wick out/get fuzzy.  With smaller text you run the risk of it becoming illegible without it.

2) Makes for a thinner better feeling print.

When printing the grey and white base wet on wet you need to make sure you are not laying down a TON of ink.  Just enough to allow the ink to get into the shirt when stepped on by the white base.  We also choke the white base to assist with the grey ink spreading a touch. 

With our printing the hand would be very soft and still very bright.

Other shops would prefer to print their white base through a higher mesh count, which is perfectly fine within their shops parameters.

My 2 cents.

sounds like we would print exactly the same 

[Colin]

[Wildcard]

Thanks for the feedback. I'm going to give it a crack with 3 screens and only shoot the highlight white screen if it's really not working. The plan is:
Grey box on 62T (160ish?) mesh also acting as an underbase for the rest of the design
Flash
White on 55T (140) mesh with a .5pt choke under the orange
Flash
Orange on 62T (160) mesh

If it goes well I'll post a photo to close off the thread, if it fails then I'll let the discussion dissolve away. Never admit failure...

[mimosatexas]

Adjust the orange around the small white text to allow the ink to gain or those letters may close up on you in certa I n spots.

[IntegrityShirts]

At sub-50 pieces, I'd print it:

150S underbase white
Flash
150S white
Flash
200S orange

It would go around the press twice to save one screen and it would be done in less than an hour. The 4 screen method might give the best softest print, but if I priced it as a 4 color I'd lose the job to a competitor.

I do find the grey then white underbase interesting. Never thought of trying that. Might give that tip a shot on the next big run!

[Wildcard]

Job is done and I said I would post pics. Managed to get a decent result with 3 screens, although the shirt buttons and pockets caused a bit of havoc with my off contact on the pocket print.
Grey> Flash> White> Flash> Orange.
Thanks to all that posted their opinions and advice.