Don Fenno buyers beware/Scam

[shirtguy]

I wish I had read the post from another member before my latest deal with Don Fenno. As others have said I've bought many things from Don for many years and always trusted him. He's always been there and followed up after the sale.However something is now wrong.

I sent a deposit for a dryer in mid sept 2014. Weeks went by with no dryer and very poor communication from Don. When i could get him on the phone it  was always something."Painter is sick... Running late.... Sorry for not getting back as i've been busy... etc.. etc..." After 3 months  of excuses I told Don i found another dryer and please return my deposit. He said "yes" but when i called him a week later he said he had another problem because someone bounced a ck so he's have mine next week. I tried to reach him a few more times and he has not returned a call in weeks.

I have 30 plus emails with very few responses. I've called him countless times with no replies. This is a guy that in the past that would reply to a email in mins/hours so it's not Normal. I think we will hear from others with similar situations.

Worst part now is i missed the time to get a dryer and install HVAC before the snow and we are getting 2 feet today.

Marc Brown
the shirt factory
salem NH

[dirkdiggler]

not a bad idea to check here for advice before sending money, lots of experience and knowledge here.   I know its a little late now, sorry for your loss.

[Screen Dan]

We had a very similar situation with Don last year for a used dryer.  We did end up getting the dryer, in various states of disrepair which he did eventually make good on.  But the process, which could have been taken care of in a week or two, took over 4 months to just get the damned thing in our shop and another 2 months until he addressed all of the many problems.  (No buttons, lights or knobs!??  At all!?)

I wasn't in charge of that transaction, thankfully.  But from where I stood it seemed like he was a middleman operating on a shoestring budget.  Which makes sense given the amount of money a middleman stands to make with items like this.

All in all, after months of headaches, we got a damned great deal on a damned good dryer...it just took months of tooth pulling, hand holding and outright badgering over phone and email to get that good deal.

Like I said, I wasn't in charge of that transaction but I highly doubt the person who was would ever voluntarily engage in business with Don Fenno ever again.  I know I certainly wouldn't.

[Homer]

damn, I bought some stuff from Don, I thought he was a stand up guy...He's a member here too so he will see this...in fact, I'll make sure of it.

[Screen Dan]

damn, I bought some stuff from Don, I thought he was a stand up guy...He's a member here too so he will see this...in fact, I'll make sure of it.

I heard that from many people prior to our dealings with him.  As such I believe it.  As OP said specifically, it doesn't seem normal. 

I'm sure there are reasons.  It's just a pain to deal with one more budget and deadline ruining factor when already juggling so many others...all while trying to maintain as much production as possible so you can afford to do the project in the first place.

[shirtguy]

thx for the comments. I had outstanding transactions with Don in the past and would have never ever thought this would happen. That is partly why i waited so calmly through the last 4 months. I really wanted to believe him.  I wish i had seen it coming . The excuses he used just didn't add up and there was always a new excuse.

you know the saying.. "fool me once shame on you. fool me twice shame on me"

[alan802]

Unfortunately, and I don't say this lightly, the used equipment brokers in our industry lack a lot of attributes that make for good business owners and operators.  I have read a lot of good comments about a few brokers over the years, but the VAST majority of them don't have the character that you'd expect them to have when doing a lot of deals using the honor system.  I understand that business is not easy, trust me, I've thought about doing it due to the extremely low number of trustworthy brokers out there, but I know I'd not be that good at it because of numerous personal flaws.  I've had conversations with several high character new equipment guys and I'm sure they're biased, but I've been told of numerous deals gone bad where the new equipment guys have had to come in and pick up the pieces.

As I said earlier, there are issues that are out of the broker's control, even one of the guys I respect a ton in this industry has unhappy customers so nobody is perfect.  With that being said, it sure does seem like our industry suffers from poor used equipment brokers more than others do.  It used to be looked down upon to be a used car salesman, many years ago, and luckily there are plenty of ethical companies selling used cars, I just wish our industry could turn around that stereotype like the car industry has. 

[Frog]

I thik that one of the problems with this business, when a seemingly upright broker has issues, is no cushion of cash on which to fall back upon when a deal goes south.

When another client's bounced check affects the ability to repair a previous broken deal, it gets close to a Ponzi scheme as the basis of the business.
One should not need that money from Peter, to make good with Paul.

I see now why some areas require licences and bonding and insurance for some businesses.

[3Deep]

Buying used sometimes takes alot of luck on both parts that the actual person selling thru the broker is telling all the truth to the broker and that's what they have to go on unless they go out and see the equipment for themsleves.  A few years back we went to a used car lot to buy a car for my son, found the car we/he liked and this company is very well known in our area and does a ton of biz really good company.  Well we take the paperwork to our bank for the loan and they tell us they can't loan money on this car, they pulled a car fax and found the car had been in a wreck (front end damage... was fixed) and the dealer knew nothing about this.  I'm sure some very good broker's get caught with there pants down like this at times and are really not trying to scam, but getting a little scammed them self, but if your going to be a middle man you better try and have all your ducks in a roll.

[ZooCity]

I thik that one of the problems with this business, when a seemingly upright broker has issues, is no cushion of cash on which to fall back upon when a deal goes south.

When another client's bounced check affects the ability to repair a previous broken deal, it gets close to a Ponzi scheme as the basis of the business.
One should not need that money from Peter, to make good with Paul.

I see now why some areas require licences and bonding and insurance for some businesses.

Bringo. 

We had a scenario akin to ScreenDan's with our last dryer.  I trust and respect the person we bought it from (it was not Don Fenno, whom I have not done a transaction with) and do not doubt they are honest and mean well.  All the same we got screwed into the previous owners running a dryer for months that we literally owned.  Lost a ton of cash and time having to move our old dryer, install (running 100a of 3ph is not cheap to setup) then pull it, reconfig hvac and wiring and finally install the new dryer.  It was delivered in the condition expected and was still a good buy in the end even with all the baloney with getting it into the damn shop.

I'm not against used equipment but more and more I see that transactions end up coming very close or matching the price of just going new from the get go. 

Sometimes things happen that are out of the broker's control and I understand that but they need to have some reserves to deal with situations like that, just like any business does.  We are still owed a few thou from that transactions and honestly, can't get even a payment on that after over a year of being open and communicative about it. 

What bothers me about these stories/situations is not that they happen but that the buyer is left standing there, that's just bad business.   These folks know that shops are buying used not just to save some money but for immediate availability which, in some cases, may be far more valuable then the cash savings and that needs to be respected. 

[Inkworks]

I have no doubt there are some great brokers out there, but in my mind it's another link in the chain to possibly have trouble with, and often another level of mark-up between you and the seller.

The good ones do a good service for both buyer and seller, the bad ones give the whole industry a bad name, not unlike used car lots.

[Evo]

One thing to keep in mind is you are buying used, so expect some BS to go with it. Hell, you can expect some BS buying new, so expect extra buying used, no matter how good the broker is.

We just installed a used Sprint. It was in exchange plus cash for our old dryer. As was the deal with the shop our old one was going to, as was the one our dryer was coming from. It was like a 5 dryer game of musical chairs with the broker, but it all worked out. However, and anyone who's pulled one dryer out and inserted another, it's like changing the engine out on your car while on the freeway. You can't pull out equipment in production till everything is set.

Now add other shop's schedules into the mix. The potential for headaches increases 10 fold.

Moral? Try to buy new, or if buying used, try to buy one that's uninstalled already and try to put your eyes and hands on it in person before you pay out.

[Hey Monkey]

I bought all new for my new shop for that exact reason. Less headaches.

[mk162]

or know who you are buying from and it helps to be handy...

I bought a new oven, DTG and a few other things.

I've purchased a used auto and our CTS...both went seamlessly because there was no broker getting in the way.  I'd do it all over again too.

[Inkworks]

I'll handle a few headaches for the $100K + I've saved buying used so far, but yes, there are challenges with used gear.