Need help and honest opinion to setup a new discharge/water-based only workshop

[starrider]

The $4000 is just a high end price.  Anything above that I wouldn't pay for those brands/models used.  You can find them for less, sometimes a LOT less.  Also, being that youre in a huge city, you should be able to find a lot of used equipment easily and quickly.

I did a quick search on craigslist in your area and found the following:

http://chicago.craigslist.org/sox/bfs/4590551882.html (no price, but a great brand/model of press and two dryers and some peripherals)

Also. this site: http://www.screenprintexchange.com though I dont know if they are scammy, which you need to be aware of.

Look on digitsmith.com as well

Thanks for your search.

Yeah, I saw the craigslist ad before, it's 9500 for everything. Not sure if it's worth it cause some items are 20 years old, it's about time to brake down. Not sure if this theory work on screen printing equipments.

screenprintexchange price is pretty high, what do you think?

Thanks again!

[starrider]

Mimosatexas covered the dryer part and checking your amperage. But what about getting the equipment into your space, stairs, narrow door ways or hall ways? A small dryer will be slow, it can be done but slow.

Other considerations, storing coated screens, reclaim, storage space (6 boxes for 400 shirts), washing the image in the screen. The nickel and dime stuff like squeegees, screens, adhesive, ink, emulsion, reclaim chemicals. You drop 10k on equipment you may need another 1k to get started.  Are you going to need a flash for your prints?

Water base and discharge can be just as harmful as plastisol, maybe not in the same ways but it can be. If you can do WB you can handle plastisol.

Used equipment is the way to go there are plenty of good deals to be had just don't fall for junk. Like Frog said there are plenty of brains to pick here and don't fall for the 1k starter kit with everything you need. There is a reason one new press is 5k and the whole starter kit with press, exposure unit, dryer and supplies is 1k.

Not killing the idea, sounds like you have put some thought into all this just make sure you have all the details before dropping a pile of money on stuff that may or may not work out.

Gas dryer would most likely be out of the question from the space you are describing.

Thanks for your input.

Yeah, seem like gas dryer is too big for my space now.

You are right, I want to make sure I have all the details before I actually drop the money on the equipments. I want to get the best value possible with the limited budget.

Thanks!

[sqslabs]

Thanks for your input.

What kind of physical setup needed for the gas dryer? Is it complicated and costly to setup all the gas pipe? I plan to setup my workshop in my live/work loft in city setup, is it possible for the gas dryer? Will my living space get affected by the gas dryer? Sorry for the stupid questions because "gas dryer" seems much more industrial to me, it sounds like a factory setup to me.

Any particular brand and model of gas dryer (new or used) for consideration with my limited budget?

A gas dryer is no more industrial than an electric one, although they can be a bit larger to start with.  It's just a different way of curing ink which is based more on airflow.  That airflow is key to curing waterbased and discharge inks efficiently. 

Gas dryers usually require less power than electric ones, but more on the setup side of things.  I didn't realize you were setting up at your residence though, and probably should have done a bit more than skimming the thread before posting.  In that case, and as others have already pointed out, a gas dryer probably isn't the best bet until you're printing out of a larger commercial space.

Great info in this thread all around.  Good luck with the prints.

[starrider]

Thanks for your input.

What kind of physical setup needed for the gas dryer? Is it complicated and costly to setup all the gas pipe? I plan to setup my workshop in my live/work loft in city setup, is it possible for the gas dryer? Will my living space get affected by the gas dryer? Sorry for the stupid questions because "gas dryer" seems much more industrial to me, it sounds like a factory setup to me.

Any particular brand and model of gas dryer (new or used) for consideration with my limited budget?

A gas dryer is no more industrial than an electric one, although they can be a bit larger to start with.  It's just a different way of curing ink which is based more on airflow.  That airflow is key to curing waterbased and discharge inks efficiently. 

Gas dryers usually require less power than electric ones, but more on the setup side of things.  I didn't realize you were setting up at your residence though, and probably should have done a bit more than skimming the thread before posting.  In that case, and as others have already pointed out, a gas dryer probably isn't the best bet until you're printing out of a larger commercial space.

Great info in this thread all around.  Good luck with the prints.

Thanks for your input.

I will probably buy a electric dryer since the startup cost is lower than the gas dryer. Will ask more specific questions after I acquire my equipments piece by piece.

Thanks!

[jvanick]

If you'd like to check out the Kruzer in person, I'm up in Cary, IL.. about 45-50 minutes north-west of the city... you're more than welcome to drop by and see the shop... drop me a PM here if you're interested.

[Inkworks]

If you go electric, go with the longest tunnel you can fit/afford. I'd say 6ft. minumum, 8 ft is better. Yes you can cure WB/DC with a smaller unit, but belt speed will eventually cause a bottleneck. We can run ~ 25-30dz/hr. on my 24" 14' (8.5' tunnel) electric with no air without issue for 14 x 14" full front or back. The dryer has great ventilation, but no air blowers in the tunnel, just 4 IR panels.

[starrider]

If you'd like to check out the Kruzer in person, I'm up in Cary, IL.. about 45-50 minutes north-west of the city... you're more than welcome to drop by and see the shop... drop me a PM here if you're interested.

Thanks for your offer.

Are you a dealer? If so, do you have a store with all the press and equipments displayed (new or used)?

Let me know, Thanks!

[starrider]

If you go electric, go with the longest tunnel you can fit/afford. I'd say 6ft. minumum, 8 ft is better. Yes you can cure WB/DC with a smaller unit, but belt speed will eventually cause a bottleneck. We can run ~ 25-30dz/hr. on my 24" 14' (8.5' tunnel) electric with no air without issue for 14 x 14" full front or back. The dryer has great ventilation, but no air blowers in the tunnel, just 4 IR panels.

Thanks for your information.

25-30 dz/hr is more than enough for me. As I only have about 800 shirts/per month to print at this point. How much does a dryer (used but in great condition) like that cost, roughly? There are different brands and models selling online, used, from about $1000 - $4000. Not sure which brand or model are the value buy for my case.

Thanks!

[Frog]

Older dryers, with a lot of life left, can often be found as good deals because, unlike a manual press, which someone moving up to an auto may still want to keep, dryers get replaced with larger ones, and there is often no room to keep the old one as back-up, even if they'd like to.
It's sometimes a matter of space.

My ten foot American Phoenix was thrown in with my $1500 Workhorse press just because the guy didn't want to keep paying for storage.
Not really good for your purpose, but just an example. Sometimes, the big dryers are the most needed to get moved out.

[starrider]

Older dryers, with a lot of life left, can often be found as good deals because, unlike a manual press, which someone moving up to an auto may still want to keep, dryers get replaced with larger ones, and there is often no room to keep the old one as back-up, even if they'd like to.
It's sometimes a matter of space.

My ten foot American Phoenix was thrown in with my $1500 Workhorse press just because the guy didn't want to keep paying for storage.
Not really good for your purpose, but just an example. Sometimes, the big dryers are the most needed to get moved out.

Thanks for your reply again frog.

This old one goes for real cheap, and it looks like heavy duty to me : http://www.ebay.com/itm/National-Screen-Printing-Company-Conveyor-Dryer-Model-N3611-/251596381500?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3a94501d3c

The problem is : I guess this company is closed down now, not sure where to get the support if i have problems with the dryer.

If this is a good buy, I will probably buy it and save some cash.

Thanks!

[jvanick]

Thanks for your offer.

Are you a dealer? If so, do you have a store with all the press and equipments displayed (new or used)?

Let me know, Thanks!

Not a dealer, just a screen printer that was where you're at now about 5 years ago or so.

[sqslabs]

Just a heads up, a used Kruzer just popped up on Digitsmith.

http://www.digitsmith.com/m-r-kruzer-manual-press-41577.html

[tonypep]

If you're in a live/work city loft this whole idea is sketchy. Sorry to be a Debbie Downer but you have a lot of issues here. I would exclude gas you would probably need a propane tank unless its an old bldg. with gas heat and stoves but there wld likely be zoning issues. I wld also exclude a ZFS system due to fumes. And the NF vs has a strong ammonia order. Also waste ink issues. Color mixing, etc.
Much more.

[Inkworks]

Thanks for your information.

25-30 dz/hr is more than enough for me. As I only have about 800 shirts/per month to print at this point. How much does a dryer (used but in great condition) like that cost, roughly? There are different brands and models selling online, used, from about $1000 - $4000. Not sure which brand or model are the value buy for my case.

Thanks!

My Hix 2414 was $200, but that was probably an extreme deal. It depends on how long you can wait for the right deal to come along, but I'd say anything less than $1000 would be a good find.

[Sbrem]

We run 3 - 20+ year old dryers all day, every day. 2 are large, with gas sections, and one small, 10'/24" Cincinnati all electric. If you go used, just get someone who knows their stuff to look at it with you...

Steve