providing designs before the sale

[mk162]

I am dealing with this right now.  And from all people my dad, WHO STARTED THIS BUSINESS.  He wants to see a printed sample for his church, they were concerned about a couple of things and he is pestering the piss out of me to set up the press for a 2 color print and do one shirt for him.  Ridiculous.

Sheesh.

[Chadwick]

Watermark or sign your previews.
Never send high res.
They want a good look, come on down ( or pay ).

Simple enuf.
 

[royster13]

The answer will depend on how much work you have......If you have lots of work you can have a policy that drives work away.....If you need work you need a policy that bring you work....

[terryei]

I think everybody gets this a lot.
The public does not know how we produce shirts, (your dad should?), but in the past I have explained it this way:
Contractor wanted one sample to see placement, etc.  I asked him if he would dig a foundation for my new house so I could see what it looked like, and then fill it in and I might build later.
I asked a glass company to put a new window in my building to see if I liked the view.
A landscaper was asked to put in a tie wall, I asked a pizza joint if I could sample all their flavors.
If explained in terms, nicely, that they can relate to, they seem to understand more.
I've yet to have a strip club ask for a sample, I've got some ideas!

[Dottonedan]

The answer will depend on how much work you have......If you have lots of work you can have a policy that drives work away.....If you need work you need a policy that bring you work....

That would make sense if you were one of 50 printers in the world and the world only needed 5 printers.
The intent behind what you say is true, but does not apply to every business model.

Disney for example, get get shirts printed anywhere. Most all printers would like to pick up Disney as a customer but to do business with them is far more difficult that one could imagine. First, they have many categories and areas to cover. They have probably 200 product buyers just in the division I am familiar with. If you want to work with the smaller buyers, they work with more printers than most. This is because the quantities are far less than most categories and the more experienced Disney printers know not to play with them. They eat all of your profits and actually cost you money to work with them simply because of the art.

All Disney buyers make you jump through hoops and go through multiple revision. Some times as many as five. This is because it cost them nothing. They have no idea how much is lost on revision, nor would that matter to them. Everyone wants to say they have Disney as a customer. The draw or carrot is that you do make money on the larger quantity orders. Everyone wants to eventually be one of those that gets a big order from one of those larger categories. Buyers have grown up on the idea (by previous printers) not charging for art that the art cost very little to nothing.  So now, all new buyers have not experienced being charged for art. If they were now, they would not use you and would think that you don't know what you're doing.

On the flip side, Smaller company's like many of you know full well the value of the art and charge "something". Eventually, you get larger or more eager to please and pick up more big name accounts and you start sacrificing some of your normal charges. Most being art and screens. 9Thats another thing that the larger company's do not pay for. The also do not typically pay for "sampling charges". What happens most often is that the printer builds that into the normal cost of the orders (and is not that big of an impact on large quantities). Thats not as easy these days, since most larger company's are now ordering smaller but more frequently.

[Frog]

The answer will depend on how much work you have......If you have lots of work you can have a policy that drives work away.....If you need work you need a policy that bring you work....

That really fits this industry's model. We often see newcomers slashing prices and offering freebies only to eventually realize that it wasn't profitable. I can't tell you how many calls and emails I get that end up with the potential client saying "really? the last guy I used didn't charge for art samples/revisions/press proofs or didn't charge extra for onesie and twosie fill-ins, or was just way cheaper in general"

You know where this is going.

I reply, 'well, why aren't you going back there?"

"oh, they have closed down"

This is a generalization and over simplification, but I suspect that more than one veteran out there sees the truth in this.
And back to your statement, Royster. I believe that there is also a segment out ther that will put more value in our time and product if they are forced to pay for it, not unlike Freud's theory of effective therapy. It has more perceived value, and is taken more seriously if it is actually paid for.

[squeegee]

The answer will depend on how much work you have......If you have lots of work you can have a policy that drives work away.....If you need work you need a policy that bring you work....

That really fits this industry's model. We often see newcomers slashing prices and offering freebies only to eventually realize that it wasn't profitable. I can't tell you how many calls and emails I get that end up with the potential client saying "really? the last guy I used didn't charge for art samples/revisions/press proofs or didn't charge extra for onesie and twosie fill-ins, or was just way cheaper in general"

You know where this is going.

I reply, 'well, why aren't you going back there?"

"oh, they have closed down"

This is a generalization and over simplification, but I suspect that more than one veteran out there sees the truth in this.
And back to your statement, Royster. I believe that there is also a segment out ther that will put more value in our time and product if they are forced to pay for it, not unlike Freud's theory of effective therapy. It has more perceived value, and is taken more seriously if it is actually paid for.

I couldn't agree more, we blow off people who think they should have the art first and pay later, if they like it.  No free art or proofs here, period.

[Dottonedan]

I believe that there is also a segment out there that will put more value in our time and product if they are forced to pay for it, not unlike Freud's theory of effective therapy. It has more perceived value, and is taken more seriously if it is actually paid for.

It seems this one is a popular theory.  I've said many times on the boards that my old high school art teacher once told me (in a nut shell) "if you charge very little for it, they will value it the same way". He past away just this June. He retired the year I graduated in 1986.
Robert (Bob) Lee Haddix, July 4, 1927 - June 25, 2011

I say, if its free, it's worth nothing unless it's a cherished gift with emotional and relational connection. So ask your self, you do have emotional and relational connections with this customer?