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screen printing => Equipment => Topic started by: 3Deep on March 20, 2013, 03:38:00 PM
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Yesterday I was setting up a print on a 230 mesh full of halftones, did all adjustments squeegee angle, stroke pressure etc make the sample print very nice, set all the other color sample again nice. Now halfway thru the run I start getting a bad print on the halftone screen, and what I found out is my squeegee angle had changed seems like the squeegee holder is slipping and it was tight, so I reset my angle and it did it again. Anybody have trouble with that part slipping and how did you fix it...I did back off the pressure and that seemed to help...here is a bad pic.
Darryl
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You can try Anatol bwahahahaha
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Could be the threads in the kip handle are bottoming out, bolt too long. I would try adding a flat washer which would give more room for the bolt to tighten before it bottoms out. Or at least measuring it and make sure that is not happening.
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What bink said, but maybe the addition of some type of lock washer.
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You can try Anatol bwahahahaha
there is some indication that Anatol is turning the corner. Hopefully the issues are behind them now.
pierre
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Anatol call and said the same thing as you all,add a lock washer, the press is 5 years old now so I expect some wear and tear. You know I'm kinda thinking this could have been going on for some time now and I just really never had time to stop and check it out....I would just crank it down more and keep printing, but hey thanks.
Darryl
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We have had problems with this on like 3 of our heads on our anatol. It actually got so bad on our front and rear adjustments for a while we had to use a vice-grips to adjust the stroke. Good old anatol support was going to get back to me ::) with what to do.... They must be busy, because I have been waiting for that call for 2 years now! I may give up on them soon.
I actually ended up machining new parts for ours. I know that doesn't help you. My advice would be to get a new part, but that may take a year to get if you buy it directly through anatol. I had some luck with OTS out in CA for parts.
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I'd call OTS if I had an Anatol.
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Anatol call and said the same thing as you all,add a lock washer, the press is 5 years old now so I expect some wear and tear. You know I'm kinda thinking this could have been going on for some time now and I just really never had time to stop and check it out....I would just crank it down more and keep printing, but hey thanks.
Darryl
Anatol called. That's a good thing. It means that they care, and they are reading the forum. ;)
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So basically the squeegee angle kip lever doesn't hold the angle where you want it right? I've seen that happen on press when excessive pressure is applied or when the pressure is too high and you have an ink that is overpowering the blade. A kip lever can strip out but if it's not stripped then how does it become less effective at it's job over time is what I'm asking? It's like saying a nut and bolt that isn't stripped was working as it was designed then over a period of time it stopped. I think it's either defective from the beginning, as in a design flaw or your pressure and other variables simply overpowered the mechanics of the chopper assembly. Just my 2 pennies.
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Could be the threads in the kip handle are bottoming out, bolt too long. I would try adding a flat washer which would give more room for the bolt to tighten before it bottoms out. Or at least measuring it and make sure that is not happening.
Well before I left the shop today I measured the bolt and tighten knob and it has plenty of thread room to crank down on(no bottoming out), so adding a lock washer might not do anything unless the knob might be loosen somehow during production , but it feels tight. Seem like to me they would have make some kind of teeth there instead of having two smooth surfaces' to tighten up on each other. If the lock washer does not work I might try roughing up both surface's with a file or something.
Darryl
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So basically the squeegee angle kip lever doesn't hold the angle where you want it right? I've seen that happen on press when excessive pressure is applied or when the pressure is too high and you have an ink that is overpowering the blade. A kip lever can strip out but if it's not stripped then how does it become less effective at it's job over time is what I'm asking? It's like saying a nut and bolt that isn't stripped was working as it was designed then over a period of time it stopped. I think it's either defective from the beginning, as in a design flaw or your pressure and other variables simply overpowered the mechanics of the chopper assembly. Just my 2 pennies.
well Alan I've thought about part of what you said, to much chopper pressure, and no the kip lever is not stripped nor the bolt...I don't think it's the ink, alls I know is I had it at 15 degree angle and halfway thru the run it was at 20 thats a 5 degree jump using 70/90/70 squeegee blades. Now you might be on to something there about the choppers cuz I have to put more pressure on one chopper than the other on that head to get it to print even. I might take the choppers off the flash head being I never use that head for printing much and they are like new, hey thanks Alan.
Darryl
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Let us know if the lock washer worked, it will be good to know for future!
Plus, I'm kinda jealous anatol called you back.... I just knew it they must think I'm fat or ugly, I never get a second date :P
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So basically the squeegee angle kip lever doesn't hold the angle where you want it right? I've seen that happen on press when excessive pressure is applied or when the pressure is too high and you have an ink that is overpowering the blade. A kip lever can strip out but if it's not stripped then how does it become less effective at it's job over time is what I'm asking? It's like saying a nut and bolt that isn't stripped was working as it was designed then over a period of time it stopped. I think it's either defective from the beginning, as in a design flaw or your pressure and other variables simply overpowered the mechanics of the chopper assembly. Just my 2 pennies.
well Alan I've thought about part of what you said, to much chopper pressure, and no the kip lever is not stripped nor the bolt...I don't think it's the ink, alls I know is I had it at 15 degree angle and halfway thru the run it was at 20 thats a 5 degree jump using 70/90/70 squeegee blades. Now you might be on to something there about the choppers cuz I have to put more pressure on one chopper than the other on that head to get it to print even. I might take the choppers off the flash head being I never use that head for printing much and they are like new, hey thanks Alan.
Darryl
What do you have your choppers set at? We usually keep ours around 11-15ish...
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Hmmm that's kinda high for us I'm normally just below that and I angle my squeegees at around 10 to 15 angle 70/90/70 duro, now if I'm running just the single 70 duro I might go to 10 or just a little higher.
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You can try Anatol bwahahahaha
BTW that was an indirect prompt to see if they were actually paying attention. I recd a call Monday from a new rep from Anatol. He was quite attentive and sympathetic to my past issues with their products and service and did not press on any further. Sorry but all that plus their suspiciously high employee turnover takes them out of the game for me. Others have had much better experiences. Time will tell.
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You can try Anatol bwahahahaha
I recd a call Monday from a new rep from Anatol. He was quite attentive and sympathetic to my past issues with their products and service and did not press on any further. Sorry but all that plus their suspiciously high employee turnover takes them out of the game for me. Others have had much better experiences. Time will tell.
Totally agree. I have actually received 3 of those same calls, they stopped calling me after that but I know of at least 2 people that took the position since they stopped calling. The calls ALL went something like"I am here to make a change. Things are different now. Now we have seemed to have misplaced the list of issues you have had since month 1, can you send it again please?" I actually was so pissed(If you cant tell from my pro anatol comments) once, when a new guy called to introduce himself, I thanked him and advised him to not hang any pictures on the wall in his office. It would save him time in 2 months when he needed to take them down....
Back to the original topic, I hope the issue is fixable, and if it is easy please let us know!
I checked the press this morning, when we do halftones, we have it at about a 10 angle with just under 10 for pressure with minimal off contact. So we seem to be close to in the same boat there.
The whole thing is a shame because when their presses work they are good machines. It is just the company behind them that is disgusting.
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I know another press like that(I own it). The nice thing is there are 2 parts suppliers, the better one is cheaper. ;)
I feel like a US company could start stocking parts for the 2 presses and do very well with an online store...very well. Same day shipping, blah, blah.
While I don't think they make the best press, M&R has the best service...also, there are so many independent techs out there that work on them too. Kinda like tajima, they are so popular, that techs almost have to know how to work on them to make a living.
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Best of luck to Anatol, but unfortunately we've all (well, many of us) heard that they've turned a corner and getting better but then you still continue to see and hear the contrary. I get a call from a new rep every couple of months but I don't call back or take the calls. There is one common denominator in this, and as long as that doesn't change, I don't see any long term improvements being made. Again, just my opinion on the matter. And when I was press shopping, the Anatol was high on the list due to it's features and price. At the time they did have a nice loyal employee working his butt off, along with another young guy that was passionate and hard working, but those two saw the writing on the wall and I do think they were a part of the solution and not the problem. I think we all know the problem, but how do you fix that? I'd love to pick Paul and Matt's brain on that subject, I bet they got some stories.
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Brad I agree with you, I don't think M&R make the best press, but Rich has the best service and always willing to back up his products old or new and that's a big plus for anyone owning his products, Anatol I think has the best bang for the bucks for there products and a pretty nice press with issues here and there, and there main issue is not having a ton techs running all over the place. Would I buy another Anatol yes, I would love to give them advice on some things that really need to be fix or redesigned, my press has been great to this point, but you expect things to break down over the years and I think thats whats happen right now, but nothing major. Parts price yep buddy I think cost a little to much from Anatol so yes I've found parts from other places cheaper for one I bought an Air/oiler from another company for $55 bucks complete unit which if I bought from anatol would have coast me $100 plus bucks and the heat bulbs for the Rapid wave flash I paid like $98 and some change a pc from anatol and found another place and got them for $58 and change big difference. Again I would still buy another Anatol I might want to make a trip to them before it hit my floor. Thoughts all over the place before I forget here,is it possible to have one chopper weaker than the other causing you to apply more pressure to one side...that could very well be my problem on that kip lever slipping.
Darryl
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Keep an eye on cheap oilers. I got one that didn't oil...that is dangerous.
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Brad I agree with you, I don't think M&R make the best press, but Rich has the best service and always willing to back up his products old or new and that's a big plus for anyone owning his products,
I agree with this also.
Anatol I think has the best bang for the bucks
I would agree with this on their 2 lowest level auto presses. Once you start getting into SOME of the Stratus and all of the Vindicator and Trident - Not a chance. I actually know a place that has a Vindicator, and will never buy another anatol product again.
I think anatol survives on their presses that are under $25k. Some people love them and have had nothing but good luck, and that is awesome for them. But I am willing to wager a large amount that a large majority of anatol owners would NOT buy another anatol if they were upgrading or adding another press.
When we added a second auto it would of been nice to have another machine that had the same operating setup because it would of been familiar, but anatol was not even considered. That actually says a lot, because the local rep for our supplies that sells anatol I actually consider a friend.
I'm sure a Vindicator or a Trident would be a kick a$$ machine, the company that supports them and kinda stands behind them, not so much.
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TCT you could be right, John from anatol call me today checking to see if everything was alright, If I had more space in my building I very well could have bought an M&R, but Anatol fit the bill and was very nice before and after the sell...I think they lost a great guy with Paul. Sometimes you got to pay to play with the big boys being M&R is like giant right now in screenprint auto's, maybe not the best or cheapest press but has great!!! service after the sell. I'll let everyone know if this problem gets fixed or if it's user error.
Darryl
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I thought screen printers were exempt from operator error... Didn't you get the memo?