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screen printing => Ink and Chemicals => Topic started by: Logoman on November 16, 2014, 09:14:19 AM
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For those who are using Dip Tanks, what chemicals are you using in the Tank, cost ect?
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We have been using CCI products (dip & Strip) but Easiway is quite a bit cheaper and they ship for free
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Xenon has a host of options.
Dip Tank Solutions
XER 25. 25 - 1 concentrated emulsion remover. $58.50
One Step. Ink remover, emulsion remover, degreaser all in one. $28.50 per gallon. This is NOT a concentrate.
Ink Removers
Plastiwash. $107.50 per five gallon pail.
Haze and Ghost Removers
F.S.I.C. $175 per five gallon pail
Xen Magic. $137.50 per five gallon pail
Degreaser. $11 per gallon. This is a neutralizing degreaser.
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I use Franmar one step solution. I purchase the 2.5 gal container at a cost of $130. The stuff works really great.
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We use either CCI Gem-Zyme which is dirt cheap or CPS liquid stencil remover conc. 1:25 which is a bit more expensive but does a very good job.
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CCI Gem-zyme here. Can't beat it for the price and it works great.
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We have been using CCI products (dip & Strip) but Easiway is quite a bit cheaper and they ship for free
We just switched to CCI dip & strip from easiway supra as it was cheaper for us. Interesting how that works out sometimes.
charged up a 105 gallon tank with 2 - 5 gallons of D&P two weeks ago and the strength is perfect. Unlike Supra, if you add to much it dissolves the emulsion whereas the D&P just gets it soft. Breaks down the ink a little better as well.
I've been a long time user of CCI products and always seem to end up using their products as they always out perform all the others.
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I use supra in my tank, and 701 to dehaze and degrease. Had my tank set up for about 10 months with one gallon recharge a few months ago. Still breaking down hardened sp1400 screens without issue. I agree it is almost too good on say an unhardened short run higher mesh HVP screen. If I am not careful with dip time the emulsion will start coming off the screen. For the 1400 though it never does anything but soften, even if it sits in there for 30 minutes.
I'll likely try a different chem next time I need to just so I have the experience with what's out there. If it sucks I will just go back to the Supra.
Does anyone else use something akin to 701 that will take off plastisol and waterbased ghost/remnants and degrease in one? All the other dehaze type products I have tried mess with emulsion adhesion without a true degreaser after, which just adds time without adding any benefit over the 701. More curious than anything as I likely will just stick with 701.
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I use Easyway Supra. It removes the ink and emulsion. BUT I remove 99% of the ink prior to dipping, knowing Supra was designed to remove ink and emulsion. It just seems like it prolongs the life of the chemicals.
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I use supra in my tank, and 701 to dehaze and degrease. Had my tank set up for about 10 months with one gallon recharge a few months ago. Still breaking down hardened sp1400 screens without issue. I agree it is almost too good on say an unhardened short run higher mesh HVP screen. If I am not careful with dip time the emulsion will start coming off the screen. For the 1400 though it never does anything but soften, even if it sits in there for 30 minutes.
I'll likely try a different chem next time I need to just so I have the experience with what's out there. If it sucks I will just go back to the Supra.
Does anyone else use something akin to 701 that will take off plastisol and waterbased ghost/remnants and degrease in one? All the other dehaze type products I have tried mess with emulsion adhesion without a true degreaser after, which just adds time without adding any benefit over the 701. More curious than anything as I likely will just stick with 701.
I have tried 2-3 other ink degraders, and have come back to 701 it works as an ink degrader and a degreaser.
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We just switched to water in the dip tank so it`ll be a post exposure tank, and we're going back to the stack method for reclaiming. For us it's faster, cheaper and leaves a cleaner screen when done.
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Anyone running ER80?
Gary Fox is recommending it over Gem-Zyme, and running it at a ratio of half gallon per tank (I assume 30 gallon tank). That puts the cost at about $25 per tank... hard to beat that.
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We do. Gary is a great rep BTW. He really caters to your specific needs.
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CCI GemZyme here, but I do a 2 step process. I remove the ink with CCI's HR-30 prior to the emulsion step. GemZyme is very economical and will sometimes go 6 months for my little shop. I might "spike the tank" once or twice with a half gallon towards the end of its life but I haven't done the math to see if its a good idea.
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We just switched to water in the dip tank so it`ll be a post exposure tank, and we're going back to the stack method for reclaiming. For us it's faster, cheaper and leaves a cleaner screen when done.
What are the steps to stack method.
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Anyone running ER80?
We do. It works great. We do "charge" the tank every morning with a small splash.
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Anyone running ER80?
We do. It works great. We do "charge" the tank every morning with a small splash.
Just a "wild" assumption, but I bet you go through more screens than we do. :)
We do TOPS 20 a week. LOL
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Anyone running ER80?
We do. It works great. We do "charge" the tank every morning with a small splash.
Just a "wild" assumption, but I bet you go through more screens than we do. :)
We do TOPS 20 a week. LOL
Correct. We reclaim 20-30 screens per day.
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We've been using Kor-Chem CP1 used to be called complete. Out of all the popular tank chems it's had the longest life for us. Awesome inexpensive stuff. SPA sells it as their inhouse SPA brand. We usually drain the tank down every 2 -3 weeks, let the big hunk of sludge fall onto some plastic outside, let that harden in the sun, wash the tank out, re-fill it with the original chems and top it off. We are well over 14 months right now on the original chems. The last one I tried besides this was CCI, it lasted 3 weeks. Was a waste of money. Back to Kor-Chem and rockin.
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This stuff?
http://www.screenprocess.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=SPAERCON&CartID=1 (http://www.screenprocess.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=SPAERCON&CartID=1)
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They call ink SPA ink/emulsion remover for diptank. http://www.screenprocess.com/product-p/spaier.htm (http://www.screenprocess.com/product-p/spaier.htm) If you tell them KorChem CP2 it used to be called complete now it's been enhanced and renamed to CP2. Tanner got us using it a few years and it's knocked every other popular one out of the block, especially how long it lasts
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That is cheap!
What ratio do you use?
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Also, do you clean your ink out in a booth before dropping them in the tank or do you go with the tank for both?
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he system we have put in place is currently all in one booth. I've come up with a home made 4 stage filtering system so that our exhausting water is about as clean as it can get. My guy will take a carded off screen, still having the tape from the job on it into the booth, few sprays of Franmar Beeniedoo, lightly works that into the ink which is awesome stuff turns it into really easy to rinse liquid. Sprays it down with the pressure washer, peels the tape. Tape comes off easier doing it in this way, plus, we aren't throwing wet plastisol that is on the tape in the garbage. That mess all ends up in the filters. He will usually do a stack of 40 screens like that. Then use CCI pink stuff to scrub the booth, which also degreases it. Then starts at the beginning of that stack 2 at a time in the diptank. I have a video that I can send you that someone asked me to make for them showing the tank, the drip rail and the filter system in action. It works very efficient, very affordable, and our screens are very clean. After the rinse off from the dip tank, we use a gently scrubbing of CCI pink stuff for final clean and degreasing, rinse and rack. Since we went to this system he must be at a 1 out of every 100 screens with fisheye coating with Chromablue emulsion. Not bad. When we used all the other spray on products, I think they get all over the walls and the roof of the booth and drip when you can't see it and cause problems. I like the pink stuff paste, for us. Having the ink off of the screens before the tank also let's that juice last longer. When that gunk sits at the bottom of the tank, the chems are always reacting with it and die out faster. That's another reason why I have him drain it ever 2-3 weeks to dump the gunk out. I won't name other products, but if it's a popular one for the tank, we've tried it and none of them last as long as this stuff has for us. Hope this helps.
Mike
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Also, do you clean your ink out in a booth before dropping them in the tank or do you go with the tank for both?
The million dollar question. If you're washing the ink off first then the dip tank is just a really expensive way to apply emulsion remover....
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Thanks Mike!
Yeah, inkworks, that's kind of true... but I'm betting in the long run it's cheaper and less time consuming. I will be putting my money where my mouth is on that bet soon as we are about to do that.
I've heard nearly everyone say they do it this way because it makes the chemicals last longer.
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We've been using Kor-Chem CP1 used to be called complete. Out of all the popular tank chems it's had the longest life for us. Awesome inexpensive stuff. SPA sells it as their inhouse SPA brand. We usually drain the tank down every 2 -3 weeks, let the big hunk of sludge fall onto some plastic outside, let that harden in the sun, wash the tank out, re-fill it with the original chems and top it off. We are well over 14 months right now on the original chems. The last one I tried besides this was CCI, it lasted 3 weeks. Was a waste of money. Back to Kor-Chem and rockin.
I use korchem complete too and agree it lasts waaaay longer than supra or franmar. I need to transfer mine into another tank because the sludge on the bottom is getting all over the rollers on my frames. Never had this problem before because the fluid has never lasted this long!
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If you build a drip rail, you will use lesssssssss chem vs spraying it down the drain. We rack 2 frames on the rail, the Chem runs back in the tank. The top off is minimal vs spraying. We used spray method for 5 years before going this route and use way less Chem now. While 2 drip down the rail, 2 more go in the tank, 2 being cleaned in the booth. Nice efficient loop taken from Mr. Greg Kitson.