Let us discuss oversize printing.

[cvreeland]

We've got a 14c Challenger II & I've been looking up the specs for what it'll do image & screen-size wise, & it looks like we can get a pretty big print out of this thing.

A couple questions linger, though.

What size screen do I need to hit their max. regular image size of 20 x 28?  They state a max. frame size of 26 x 43, which sounds about right for that -- 6 inches above & below art +3 to include frame OD.

If I go to every other head to push the width, they claim 43 wide X 28 tall!  What's the absolute largest pallet I an fit if we go every other arm & double-index? Is this a horrible idea? Will it kill my indexer to run such a beast? Should I go with a flip pallet, or just glue the whole shirt down to a huge regular pallet?

Thanks for any input!

[Zelko-4-EVA]

i wont claim to be an expert, but we print all overs on our 2003 gauntlet.  set to double index, printing every other head.  i like to think that the weight of 6 all over platens weigh as much or less than 12 standard 16x22 platens. 

[tonypep]

Long topic not much time. Laying shirts on boards works in some cases and not others. Registration and over printing on boards are 2 main concerns (some use huge sheets of cardboard underneath. Wing pallets generally fail because they cannot accomodate smalls through triples, requiring some to invest tens of thousands on pallets for different sizes of shirts. Return on this is sketchy at best. At HNG we had three sets of six and they cost $1200 ea at the time. Once you do the homework on pallets consider the frame size and pre-press considerations. Can you output film that large? What about sinks, coaters, exposure units etc?
Art work should be loose. Distressed even better. Personally I would limit to no more than three colors. And always WB ink

[alan802]

If we're talking "all over" I'd run away, "jumbo/oversized" then I would consider adding since you've already got the press that can do it.  Every year someone around the shop asks why we don't do the huge all over prints they see at the mall and I have to pull out my folder that I keep all that info and research I've done and I show them why.  After the lecture I give they walk away satisfied knowing our customers would not pay what it takes to do that kind of work.  You've already got the largest investment taken care of so maybe it's not as scary for you to get into.  But we know the price of screens and pallets grows exponentially the bigger they get.  I know you've probably already punched the numbers and know your customer base and what they'll pay and if all of that looks good then you just need the things Tony talked about.  It's still not a cheap investment by any means for some shops, like us, we'd have to buy new pallets, screens, press, exposure unit, washout booth dip tank, scoop coater, etc.

[tonypep]

Thats right Alan. All that sounds obvious but it would be embarassing to mention how many companies walk halfway down this road, spend all that money, only to kill it in the end. Just left some numbskull company last year that has all the Sqg/Fldr/ Wings sitting brand new in original crates because of this.

[GraphicDisorder]

We do oversized on our press, but not all over.  We are able to satisfy MOST customers this way, we still get a few a month wanting all over, some may just be tire kickers though, hard saying.

We print 15w x 23h without changing our pallets, flashes, nothing but the screen we use.  We use 23x31s daily and have 25x36's for the jumbo stuff.  We also did be sure when we ordered our press we went with 16x25 on the pallets, which make a fine every day size pallet as well.

[ebscreen]

We haven't even mentioned the labor involved in printing all-over. Tac-ing shirts, two people to
load typically, etc.

Hopefully Mr. Spreading Ink chimes in here soon, he's somehow made it work.

There was a shop near me that bought an Alpha 8 for doing all-over. Not a year went by and they are no longer.

16" pallets are the best for most every day stuff. We have 18" and 14" and constantly have to switch for womens
garments and stuff. We can print 18x20 without changing anything though. We went after oversized work for awhile,
but much of that demand fizzled out. I'm fine with that.

[ScreenPrinter123]

We do oversized on our press, but not all over.  We are able to satisfy MOST customers this way, we still get a few a month wanting all over, some may just be tire kickers though, hard saying.

We print 15w x 23h without changing our pallets, flashes, nothing but the screen we use.  We use 23x31s daily and have 25x36's for the jumbo stuff.  We also did be sure when we ordered our press we went with 16x25 on the pallets, which make a fine every day size pallet as well.

Same here.  16x25 pallets enable us to print anything our customers have wanted and does not create a need for all kinds of new equipment.  Of course we have never had a request for an all over print so it really depends on your clientele in the end.

[ScreenFoo]

We don't do all-overs, although we do contract oversize one colors on shirts up to 18x24, blankets or sheet prints up to 25x25--all on our state-of-the-art 80's 4/4 Hopkins manual.   

Seems like most anyone walking in asking for big or all over prints here has no idea what they're trying to get into.   The only oversize printing we've done for walk-ins was for trade showy stuff, and inkjets are taking over most of that stuff...

[Parker 1]

[  We also did be sure when we ordered our press we went with 16x25 on the pallets, which make a fine every day size pallet as well.
[/quote]

Just curious, why not 16X28 or 16X30?

[GraphicDisorder]

[  We also did be sure when we ordered our press we went with 16x25 on the pallets, which make a fine every day size pallet as well.

Just curious, why not 16X28 or 16X30?
[/quote]

Our press only prints around 23-24, wasn't much point to go bigger on this particular press. 

[brandon]

Yeah, Dave at Spreading Ink can fill you in. Our max size is 20" x 22" on the Sportsmen E. That is a good size print, great for water base / discharge. We get asked about once or twice a year for AOP but they always just want 100 or so shirts. We have never had any serious clients asking for it. Besides, I know Spreading Ink and several other large large shops that specialize in it and they kind of have that market down. If you plan on getting into it be careful because of look what happened to that shop mentioned above. They are no longer with us. RIP

[cvreeland]

I'm leery, believe you me. Still need to nail down some specifics on what will actually work on this press, though. The 20 x 28 "oversize" doesn't seem like a logistical problem for now. The screens will just fit in our exposure unit & sink, though I'll have to outsource film. Been talking to a guy at M&R & he's supposed to get back to me with specifics on what our particular press will do. I sent him the serial number & he was going to look up & see how/if it was customized.

I have heard one way to tack shirts down for all-over was to use some sort of light cornstarch-based glue in one of the electric guns and to spray it inside the shirt to hold the two halves together. any practical experience with this?

[tonypep]

Yes, it sucks. Its how we did this for belt printers ;one more time consuming step involving two to three people. Its a marginkiller.

[cvreeland]

I hate my life!