Silicone Ink from Source One

[pwalsh]

i tried to print some manually today and I was disappointed in the results.  I am sure i could have gotten better results on the auto, but it was el-occupado at the time.

I ended up PFP with smart white because i didn't have time to pfp the silicone ink.

Brad:  One important thing about the silicone inks is that the viscosity and rheology is different (thinner) than plastisol.  It’s a little bit too easy to drive the ink down into the garment and end up with a dull looking print If you’re not careful.  I’d suggest that you look at the test prints that you made to see if you had excessive penetration into the fabric. 

The method that I’ve seen yield the best results is to print a light first layer being careful to lay the ink on top of the fabric to seal it, then flash and come back with a second full coverage hit.  I hope that you get another chance to try the silicone inks sometime because they do produce exceptional results on some of the otherwise PITA to screen-print Performance-Wear fabrics

[whitewater]

can you order the silicone yet?

[mk162]

peter, I think my problem was I am used to printing plastisol on a manual.  It was hard to dial back the pressure to get a great ink deposit.  I was sure I could nail it on the auto, it just takes more finesse on the manual.

[screenprintguy]

just tried this stuff tonight with a couple different inhouse designs on cotton, 50/50, and 100% poly. so far, first tries were on the manual, came no where near to what everyone had said it could do, in a single stroke. Buzzed Sam and he gave me a few pointers. Yanked the screen, which was a 156 on a newman with 40 newtons. Put on the auto, dropped my central off contact all the way down, lowered my pressure to 30psi, slow slooooooow stroke , actually 2 strokes but didn't after several tries get a true, "one hit" print. Tried a pfp and got a full vibrant white print. Cool thing was the build up was 80% less than a plastisol poly white and low cure temp yeilded a very soft finished print. Tried another design on a 110, same thing only alot more opaque. I might also mention that I used a single duro 70 squeegee blade 15 degree angle. I am happy with the final print's feel and look, but I guess we will have to play around to get the 1 hit wonder. Then again I also wonder if people have a different opinion on what is an acceptable 1 hit, or final look to their white. For us, we like a 100% full opacity white, seeing nothing of the substrate through the ink. It's cool stuff, I want to perfect it and put it in the mix. There has got to be a better clean up too. Beenie doo which works amazing on plastisol made a mess with this stuff as well as the CCI 107 inkwash that we use for final screen cleaning. I ended up using spray way screen opener to get that stuff out, then the other cleaners. I'm sure there is a chem just for this stuff, I got that stuff all over me lol. Any tips on perfecting the 1 hit wonder of this would be awesome. But even for now, it looks like a poly winner seeing how it does not bleed and cures at such a low temp.

[blue moon]

for anybody chasing the one hit, we are having good luck with it, but . . . EVERYTHING has to be right on, any small deviation from perfection and it is a PFP ink.
We are on metal platens (no rubber top) which also might make a difference. Every time we run it and we need a one stroke setup, I have to go out to the press and set it up. The press op is really very, very good, but this is beyond her reach (well, everything is beyond her reach now as she was let go, but that's another story).
we use a 55/95/55 squeegee and 110 mesh with 50% EOM (yes, that is extremely thick and it migh explain why we can do it with just one hit). Lay the squeegee down very far, at least 35 degrees, possibly pretty close to 45. Flood normal from what I can remember, stroke super slow (as slow as the press will let us). Then I back off the pressure and adjust the off contact until it's right on. I think gap is ever so slightly more than on the regular print, but very little if any. I usually adjust the stroke to go significantly past the print area to make sure everything clears before the shirts drop away from the screen. There can easily be 6" of extra travel.
The resulting print is NOT 100% white! It is brighter and cleaner than a regular plastisol print, but it is not paper white. It is at an acceptable level though. Most customers will not be comparing the print to a sheet of paper and saying this is not the same. I would say it is 95% there. The truth is, PFP produces a spectacular white, but how many athletic teams are looking for a spectacular white print?

As far as cleanup, it is a little bit of a struggle. It is very important to wash the screens as soon as possible! We are still working out the details and the screen guy says he often has to use screen opener, but I just washed a screen after use and it cleared quickly and easily (gold ink).

Wet on wet is not an option with these inks (at least as they are formulated now). If we don't flash between the colors, the second screen drives the first color into the garment and it becomes dull. Dark colors don't really need flashing though so a black and white print can be done wet on wet.

pierre

[Binkspot]

Pierre sumed it up best.

We ran black leotards last week with the white silicone on the manual. 125 mesh with a thick stencil. I could get the one hit white but had to retrain myself not to push the squeegee to hard. It is almost instinct with the white to try and and give a firm stroke. The ink moves easy through the screen and in a way self lubercating. I found by using a hard flood and a real light push stroke I could get the one hit white.

We also ran the same logo on a bunch of dark grey Under Armor jackets on the auto. Squeegee as much angle as possiable, a light print stroke and lots of off contact we could get the one hit white.

As soon as we are done with the screen I scrape the ink out and powere wash the mesh to get the silicone out. So far we have not lost a screen.

[Rob Coleman]

All:  I owe the board a status update on the Silicone project.  Lots have happened in the last two months.  I am sending an internal update to the Nazdar SourceOne team this week, and will then give an update here.  Stay tuned.  Good things happening....just slower than anticipated!  ...Rob

[mk162]

speaking...in...generalities....and....vagueness....

my impression of Rob's last post.  Sorry I had to.  I am with pierre.  we've had good luck with it, but everything needs to be perfect.  it has better coverage than a straight poly ink on a one hit white.

[Rob Coleman]

speaking...in...generalities....and....vagueness....

my impression of Rob's last post.  Sorry I had to.  I am with pierre.  we've had good luck with it, but everything needs to be perfect.  it has better coverage than a straight poly ink on a one hit white.

Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain! 

I do realize that this was vague, and I thought twice (well at least 1.5 times) before posting.  I am way behind in updating and felt I should at least throw this out there.  Plus it puts me on a communication deadline for all to see!

[Dr Slomo]

"As far as cleanup, it is a little bit of a struggle. It is very important to wash the screens as soon as possible! We are still working out the details and the screen guy says he often has to use screen opener, but I just washed a screen after use and it cleared quickly and easily (gold ink)."

Try using PlastiSolv, makes cleanup of the silicone a no-brainer, mineral spirits are great too but those are getting expensive nowadays.  if you can't get to it for a while cover it up so it is airtight with a peice of plastic wrap, both sides of the screen, that will buy you some time, but definitely don't want to hang em til tomorrow...

[chubsetc]

I ran out of my typical screen wash and ran to the store and picked up a bottle of GooGone spray Gel to hold me over while i was awaiting delivery.  That stuff broke down the silicone on the screen like nobodies business a couple hours after printing.  Whats funny is it didn't work great for plastisol but it was the best I could do at the time.

[blue moon]

"As far as cleanup, it is a little bit of a struggle. It is very important to wash the screens as soon as possible! We are still working out the details and the screen guy says he often has to use screen opener, but I just washed a screen after use and it cleared quickly and easily (gold ink)."

Try using PlastiSolv, makes cleanup of the silicone a no-brainer, mineral spirits are great too but those are getting expensive nowadays.  if you can't get to it for a while cover it up so it is airtight with a peice of plastic wrap, both sides of the screen, that will buy you some time, but definitely don't want to hang em til tomorrow...

excuse my ignorance as I am still new to the industry . . . What's PlastiSolv? WHo makes it?

pierre

[Frog]

"As far as cleanup, it is a little bit of a struggle. It is very important to wash the screens as soon as possible! We are still working out the details and the screen guy says he often has to use screen opener, but I just washed a screen after use and it cleared quickly and easily (gold ink)."

Try using PlastiSolv, makes cleanup of the silicone a no-brainer, mineral spirits are great too but those are getting expensive nowadays.  if you can't get to it for a while cover it up so it is airtight with a peice of plastic wrap, both sides of the screen, that will buy you some time, but definitely don't want to hang em til tomorrow...

excuse my ignorance as I am still new to the industry . . . What's PlastiSolv? WHo makes it?

pierre

Not exactly a press wash. http://www.silkscreeningsupplies.com/product/SP004

[chubsetc]

I'm not sure but I think plastisolve is something like brake cleaner, I'm sure it's just repurposed from some other industry.

[Dr Slomo]

I'll have to go back and get the actual number, its not the aerosolized cleaner mentioned a couple of posts up, though that may work too.  It had an orange smell to it.  Common solvents like OMS and IPA will also work but since this works so well, I've never had to try anything else.  Traveling for the next couple weeks but when i get back in, will post the product number.