Discharge vs Plastisol Vibrancy (CCI)

[ScreenPrinter123]

We have been testing the CCI system and are ready to start using it on jobs but Brian and I are struggling with comparing discharge prints to plastisol prints.  We have a job to print this week (teal and white on a delta apparel purple shirt) that I would like to use discharge but I first wanted to get your feedback on judging whether a discharge print is acceptable in comparison to how it would look if printed with plastisol.

How do you rate opacity when using pigmented discharge because next to plastisol it seems to be second rate since it does not have the pop/shine of plastisol.  The difference becomes more noticeable because plastisol often fills in the weave of the shirt and thus can hide the weave pattern of the shirt adding to the prints apparent vibrancy.

I have attached a picture where the bottom teal is a pigmented discharge using CCI products on a purple Delta shirt (with a print print through 180S; ignore the cracked texture as there was a screen further down on the press that had poorly applied tape underneath that caused that pattern).  The pigment did not match the plastisol top print above it but I think with adjusting the formulas we can get closer.  Would you go with the discharge or would you print a DC base with plastisol on top?

Do you discharge gurus assume going into it that discharge printing will yield results that by nature will look different than plastisol.  If so how do we best explain this to our customers who until now have only received plastisol prints.

Thanks!
 
Michael

[JBLUE]

Purple is not a good one to try and match with. We just explain that they are two different processes and that there will be a difference in color especially across color ways of garments. They do not react the same therefore you will get a different color variance. If it is customer that you need to play it safe with run the plastisol. If it is one that is questionable you need to take your time and explain the differences and what they could expect. You also need to test, test, and test again to get comfortable with what your results may be. Even then they can can still throw you a curve ball with dye lots. 

[ebscreen]

Purple is an iffy color to discharge to begin with, are you getting a full discharge with the garments?

For iffy colors we discharge underbase.

And you are correct in the difference between the two inks. Waterbase will never have the plastic shine,
but for nearly all of our clients, that is preferred. Even construction companies and the usual bulletproof crowd
prefer it as it breathes.

[ZooCity]

I've actually had an ok time discharging purple so far.  Not the best but better than dealing with an overdyed lot of black Ts.   

Try tweaking first, you aren't too far off, but if you hit a wall, that DC UB + plastisol looks fine to me too.

Tony mentioned using a heat gun to quick test and what a great help that is, saves all that time waiting to see it cured at back of the dryer so you don't lose your momentum.  You gotta keep that momentum up when mixing colors by eye, at least that's how I feel about it.  Bonus- you get to watch it change colors which is neato but try not breath too much while doing it.

[ScreenPrinter123]

I can say that the Delta purple discharged significantly better than the PC61 we tried.  I will give the heat gun a shot as I could not get a blow dryer to work very well.  For this job we do not need an exact pms match, I guess we will just have to get used to the difference in the way a plastisol and discharge prints looks.

[JBLUE]

A good representation of the art is what I usually tell them to give yourself some wiggle room. Same with the PMS matching. Like Zoo said that purple turned out pretty good. Better than most purples.

[ZooCity]

Looks like, ironically, it just needs a splash of white.

[brandon]

Purple? Damn, must be getting late for me or I need to get my eyes checked. Thought that was Royal! Anyway, as you noticed there is a difference between the ink types. We have clients that come from other print shops and once we educate them they almost always go for water base. And if it is a big run with a lot of real estate being printed on the shirt I always push discharge to make the run go as fast as possible

[tonypep]

I'll respond later my back.........is...........killing .............me

[tonypep]

Medkicking in thank God. OK......yes purple shirt is a bad start. The blue dye #2 used to make most purples, kellys, and royals is troublesome. That said a DC UB works well as illustrated below. With regards to vibrancy you just might find,after some practice that you can actually achieve brighter and more vivid prints
The CEO22 graphic is a purple shirt with a DCUB
Seacoast Church straight PC DC

[GraphicDisorder]

Medkicking in thank God. OK......yes purple shirt is a bad start. The blue dye #2 used to make most purples, kellys, and royals is troublesome. That said a DC UB works well as illustrated below. With regards to vibrancy you just might find,after some practice that you can actually achieve brighter and more vivid prints
The CEO22 graphic is a purple shirt with a DCUB
Seacoast Church straight PC DC

Tony someday there will be a knock at your shop, it will be my whole shop, we will be there to hang out with you and learn from you.  We will bring Pizza, Donuts, Ice Cream, and beer.  I hope you except the offering. 

[tonypep]

No problem man it just might have to be a Saturday! Meant to come by and see you and Shelly when I was in Nashville but I had to get a move on.

[ScreenPrinter123]

So if I'm butting up a white and teal, what concern should I have with the two discharge colors mixing and creating a transitional third color where they meet?  Flash in between like with a plastisol or will it make no difference?

While the rest of the clowns in New Orleans are getting drenched at the parades, we're printing - attempting to do our first real job of discharge on a 600 piece purple shirt job.  Who's dumb and who's dumber in this scenario...hmm....


And Tony, New Orleans isn't that far from Nashville :-).

[ScreenPrinter123]

Well it looks like we may have a winner for the teal...not nearly as confident about getting a good white.  As you can see our initial D-White test (180S) is not near as vibrant as the d-base with a plastisol or WB highlight.  We will try the D-white through a 150S because it is close to pleasing given it is a purple shirt.  Soft hand and breathability is a plus because these shirts will be worn by people walking the streets of New Orleans for a few hours.

Any suggestions for getting a better white.  The square test was a 180S print print with straight D-White with 6% activator.  We have screens ready to print a WB highlight if needed but I'd like to try all options first.

Tony...any chance that article for April will make it to print a couple months early 

[tonypep]

Actually I'm in Charleston these days. Here's one of the previously unrealized benefits of the DC UB. You steam of the UB jst a titch. Don't try to completely discharge it on the press. The but registered colors print pretty much like they would on a white shirt with no bleeding and no additional flashes required. The CEO22 shirt just has one quick flash (therefore it runs faster..woops another benefit). Heres an example of the reverse. We purposely over print colors to create secondary colors. There are no green, orange, purple inks/ screens, films on this print (woops again saved a bunch more money)