CMYK on darks 305 or 355?

[Homer]

 should I go 305 or 355? I have 305's here but I'm wondering if I should get something higher. What LPI should I go to? I have never done this successfully and I got 2 jobs next week, popping the ol' cherry on this stuff. Thanks! J

[LuxInks]

Hey,
We usually use 355's, but 305's should work just fine for you. Good tension is the key really. We typically do 65lpi round dot at 22.5 angel for all colors. In the past, we have also used 55lpi no worries.
Post up a pic when you get them done, let us check them out.
Good luck.
Paul

[LuxInks]

"Eliptical" dot...I stand corrected ha!

[blue moon]

305 is fine. I would stick with 55lpi. with good seps it should not be a big deal . . . Call me if you get stuck somewhere.

pierre

[Homer]

Thanks guys, I'll go 305 and see what happens. Coudray is doing the seps for us so I know we'll be set there, I'm just nervous about this. I have 2 designs to do, one is a photo of a girl that passed, so I gotta pull this off -no choice. . .

[ScreenFoo]

I've only done a couple, but gotten decent results with 305 and a 55LPI elliptical dot, and that's with so-so pre-press gear and crappy seps by yours truly.  I bet it'll turn out great.

DC underbase?

[Sbrem]

Films from Mr. Coudray will indeed be spot on. We also like 55 LPI on 305's, though in the early days of just CMYK on white we would go with
355's and 65 line.

Steve

[Dottonedan]

Yea,  I guess that Coudrey guy is ok...     I guess.

[Sbrem]

Yea,  I guess that Coudrey guy is ok...     I guess.

I bought a copy of Control Without Confusion (Joe Clarke w/Mark Coudray) and it came with the actual Nocona Boots t-shirt that was featured in the book, and all I could think was, "How the F did they do this?" It may be 20+ years old, but it's still a great book.

Steve

I also realized that I didn't know Jack compared to what could be done, hell, we were still stapling mesh to wood frames.

[Dottonedan]

Yea,  I guess that Coudrey guy is ok...     I guess.

I bought a copy of Control Without Confusion (Joe Clarke w/Mark Coudray) and it came with the actual Nocona Boots t-shirt that was featured in the book, and all I could think was, "How the F did they do this?" It may be 20+ years old, but it's still a great book.

Steve

I also realized that I didn't know Jack compared to what could be done, hell, we were still stapling mesh to wood frames.

Yes, anyone attempting to reach the best prints they can get has come across that book. Good stuff. Prob. one of THE best screen print books. I read it but it was a friends at the time and never actually bought one.  The print you refer to was posted on facebook again by Mark just about a year or so ago. Still an amazing print by even todays standards.

[Homer]

what do you guys think for squeegies, go to a softer 60 duro? I have to do kelly green and purple shirts, can't discharge either color unfortunatly. I'm using union process inks. i've heard of the triple strength inks, but is it ok to add a few grams of standard plastisol to brighten it up if they are muted?

[ScreenFoo]

I wouldn't screw with modifying, I WOULD ABSOLUTELY get the 3X Union stuff--I did some R&D with the regular stuff on white underbases, and it was pretty disappointing.   

From what I've done on darks, the only issue I ran into was having to double stroke the CMYK part to clear--it was difficult to get the colors to clear because of the 'topography' of the underbase.  You may be lucky enough to be using a *good* shirt for this type of print, and have less of an issue with it.  I get stuck with 2000's and 5000's a lot.   
I don't have a full set of 60's for the auto, used 70/90/70 triples all around.  May help with the dot piling...


I'm jealous Steve, I wish I had the shirt.   I'd say Control Without Confusion *is* the best book on screen printing available.   Certainly be interested in any suggestions on one that's better...

[blue moon]

so far the best book I have seen too! It is a little dated, but the principles are pretty solid.

as far as squeegees, the harder the better. We used to use 80's but are starting with 75's now (65/90/75). If we need more coverage, we turn the blade around for the softer duro.

not sure about the modification, if you are going to, add fluorescent inks to it rather than regular colors. I have some 3X quarts here, but never got around opening them. Regular stuff seems to work and we are familiar with it. we'll get to the other stuff one day.

pierre

[tonypep]

Adding flourescent inks to process inks is an old trick but can occaisonally cause problems due to the fact the pigments are not gound as fine and can result in loss of detail, espeically with 355 mesh.

[Dottonedan]

Good point Tony.  That reminds me of another thing I read. These are the tiny details of printing great CMYK.  I read years back that the ink particles of either Yellows or Cyans or both, are oblong shaped due to chemical makeup of certain minerals used to make the colors. As a result, 


As they are pushed through the tiny holes of a highlight area, (especially in 355,) these particles can lock into each other more so than other inks, thus clogging. This can be why some prints have screens that look great while one color Yellow or Cyan) will have detail loss in the highlight areas and shadow area.


A way to avoid that is to look at % of pen area on your mesh. Pierre uses 330's and they seem to provide the right amount of coverage and detail at the same time.


Just another tid bit.