screen printing > Ink and Chemicals

Discharge print, preflight color sequence advice

<< < (2/3) > >>

alan802:
I don't have anything to add but you shouldn't have to double stroke those 150S screens.  I could be wrong as I've only printed discharge through a 150S one time, but it deposited plenty of ink with one stroke.

Awesome information guys.

squeegee:
Definately appreciate all the feedback guys, and we may try mixing the primary colors as per Tony's suggestions for fewer screens or per Evo's suggestions, I've done my own color mixing with plastisol in a similar way to Evo's suggestion, red halftone over a solid yellow to create orange.

The reason I was thinking of double stroking is because the best results I've gotten from discharge colors was from a double stroke, better than a single with a hard flood and minimum pressure to clear the ink.  I don't know, maybe I'm too picky, the prints we've done with single strokes look fine coming off the dryer but don't wash as well as I would like.  The double stroke prints definately wash better.

Maybe I'll try more open mesh and a single stroke, but the run is not huge so I'm not worried about double stroking unless the colors smear.

I just got some 135lx, so that may be a good mesh for the brighter colors.

Thanks again for all the info and suggestions.  I'll post up a picture of the final print.

Evo:

--- Quote from: alan802 on May 10, 2011, 04:34:03 PM ---I don't have anything to add but you shouldn't have to double stroke those 150S screens.  I could be wrong as I've only printed discharge through a 150S one time, but it deposited plenty of ink with one stroke.

Awesome information guys.

--- End quote ---

With tight screens even on "normal" mesh, printing through a 150-160 you should be able to get plenty of coverage with one stroke. Two strokes will be over kill and might muddy everything up. Make sure the ink is nice and thinned out. Firm flood stroke to fill the image area and a medium pressure print. Slow the single print stroke down a bit instead of double stroking it.

Also, I did not see what brand of ink or what system this is - I am assuming water based?

For Matsui inks, I do:

Colors -
"Brite" base plus pigments
Mix
Add:
3% Fixer N
8-12% water
Mix
6% activator for most colors, 4% for reds/dark oranges
Mix

Note: in the Matsui ink mix software, some PC formulas for tints call for clear AND matte bases. (there is no specific "dye discharge" formulas in the software) I add the percentages together for these formulas and just use the "brite" base. When it calls for clear base only, no matte base, I just use the "brite" base as well.

Example, if it calls for 80% clear and 10% matte, plus 10% pigments, I use 90% brite base.

I don't use the straight "clear" discharge base at all. The bright base works for most everything and the colors "POP" much better.


For underbasing, I use the same mix as for colors above, sans pigment.


For straight white - (NOT underbase)
50% pre-mixed white base, 50% brite base
Mix
3% Fixer N
3% Printgen "C" (softener)
8-12% water
Mix
6% activator
Mix

Evo:

--- Quote from: squeegee on May 10, 2011, 06:09:46 PM ---The reason I was thinking of double stroking is because the best results I've gotten from discharge colors was from a double stroke, better than a single with a hard flood and minimum pressure to clear the ink.  I don't know, maybe I'm too picky, the prints we've done with single strokes look fine coming off the dryer but don't wash as well as I would like.  The double stroke prints definately wash better
--- End quote ---

Try a slightly slower single stroke with medium, not minimal pressure. You'll drive the ink into the fabric a bit more but you can avoid some of the muddiness that a double stroke may impart.

squeegee:
I'm going to use Sericol Texcharge for the colors, rutland white plus for the white and either Sericol activated black discharge or some Nazdar WB black for the black.  I was liking Matsui's brite white until I recently did some wash tests (including fixer N) and didn't think it discharged the fabric enough, left a lot of pigment on the surface which seems to scratch off too easily.  I should try your formula though, and I will at some point.  And to be fair to Matsui, I haven't really tried anything other than a bright yellow  and white as far as discharge goes, but the yellow I got using brite dis base wasn't any better than sericol's.  I'm mainly turned off at the white for the moment.  What I like about Sericol is there is no pigment to mix, just RFU inks and they do have a complete pantone formulation guide, which is not perfect but gets you in the ballpark if not right on.

When I say minimal pressure, I'm using approximately double the pressure I'd use for plastisol, so I'm pretty sure we're driving the ink into the fabric.  As far as tight screens we're running EZ frames and the mesh is generally stretched to manu specs as far as tension is concerned.  Mesh count and discharge is a weird subject...some say run higher mesh, other say lower, Matsui's tech support has recommended lower mesh counts to me, like sub 150, so I guess I'll just have to experiment until I get the right result.  The LX mesh is encouraging though, we're getting pretty huge EOM on it with detail relative to the thread count.

Navigation

[0] Message Index

[#] Next page

[*] Previous page