Film printers 2021

[Du Manchu]

Our Epson 3880 gave us a scare this week as a reminder that we have no backup plan for a printer with 12,500 prints.   Upgrading to the 3880 from the 1430 may be one of our best shop purchases ever, and probably saved my marriage also. LOL.   However, Epson discontinued it, and it turns my stomach to consider paying the ridiculous prices they are bringing on the used market.  So I am back down the rabbit-hole of compatibility and availability of carts, chips, and rips, and am seriously considering paying 1500-2500 for a used one or two, just so I can keep the working system in place. 

All that said, has anyone upgraded successfully this year to something new.   Are the newer versions of the T3270 still having registration issues? 

Just looking for some fresh advise before I spend good money on this convoluted process of getting black ink in film.  Not ready for CTS yet, although I know we are burning hundreds of dollars a month on film.   Any opinions or advise would be greatly appreciated. 

DuManchu

[Nation03]

If 13x19 is large enough for you I've been using a Canon iX6820 for a while now. Refillable carts are cheap and I use the Canon dye from Filmdirectonline.com. It still gives me headaches every so often but I think all printers are garbage these days so it is what it is. I don't understand why Epson always discontinues their best options lol.

[Sbrem]

We use an older T3270, have only had registration issues a couple of times, and tech talked me down off the ledge and got it going again with a deep dive into the settings...

Steve

[Maxie]

I am now using CTS but have HP lazer A3 as a back up.
Happy not to have to deal with inkjets anymore.

[cbjamel]

Love my t3270 using cadlinks xl rip. biggest thing I learned is if you print a film horizontal and have to reprint do horizontal also. minimizes problems. using ink carts from filmdirectonline.com 2 black 3 cleaning.
Shane

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

[Frog]

Love my t3270 using cadlinks xl rip. biggest thing I learned is if you print a film horizontal and have to reprint do horizontal also. minimizes problems. using ink carts from filmdirectonline.com 2 black 3 cleaning.
Shane

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

Yep, with any printer, all films of a particular design should be done in the same direction. ALWAYS!

[markdhl]

Not sure of your specifics but if :

I know we are burning hundreds of dollars a month on film ...

i would suggest you look at the financing numbers on CTS.  A good CTS system will save you on the consumables but even more in labor savings.

Again, i would need to know more so PM me or email me.  mdhlexp@aol.com

Mark Diehl
313 515 8635

[Rockers]

Not sure of your specifics but if :

I know we are burning hundreds of dollars a month on film ...

i would suggest you look at the financing numbers on CTS.  A good CTS system will save you on the consumables but even more in labor savings.

Again, i would need to know more so PM me or email me.  mdhlexp@aol.com

Mark Diehl
313 515 8635

With our CTS being down right now for reasons that are beyond me and having to deal now again with film while not having an exposure unit suitable for handling screens with film I can only say film is very inconvenient. The whole process is just slow. there is just nothing not to like about CTS, apart from when you have to spend $6K on a new head which generally shouldn`t happen too often. Please note our CTS is not from the manufacturer Mark represents.

[blue moon]

just to clear things up a bit.
How good of a fit the CTS is for you will obviously depend on your circumstances. We have a wax unit from Mark and are super happy with it. We had an inkjet based unit before and it was OK.
Going to CTS will depend on more than just the efficiency. For us, when the CTS broke, we did not fix it and used film for 2 years. The screen guy was super busy and having to work the CTS was time consuming. Art department was printing the films so all he had to do was place it on the screen and burn. Loading the CTS and printing the ripped files takes much longer. When doing 50 screens per day and saving a min each, that's almost an hour of extra time the screen guy just did not have. I am sure there are circumstances where film makes more sense (or the other way around).

As far as film, if dialed in, it can be as good as CTS and potentially better (but you better know what you are doing to get those results). We still have a film unit as backup and when we need to print oversized designs. Thus, there is an exposure unit and a film unit that back up our main equipment.

as far as printers, I have long been advocating the EPSON 4880. It is an industrial printer, very robust with plenty of support (in parts, repair knowledge, available inks, film and so on). I've bought used ones for as low as $300. If you find one with a clogged channel in the head, they are cheap and practically disposable. They take a lot of abuse and keep working. I've recovered channels after 6 month of sitting around, maybe even more. Check ebay, your local craigslist and you should be able to find one.

pierre

[Maxie]

Pierre, good to hear you have a wax unit.
About the process I have to disagree with you.
There are so many things that save time with a CTS it's a no brainer.
I'd say the only consideration is the size of your shop and how many screens you expose. 
A wax CTS can be left off, heat it up and it's ready to go, no continuous problems with clogged heads like the Epson.
We spent hours keeping our heads unblocked.
We get much better screens with our CTS, great dot's and halftones every time.    Obviously like the Epson you have to dial it in.
Maybe the screen maker doesn't have to open a file that is very quite with the Xitron, but the graphics dept have to deal with film, with takes twice as long.
Possibly one of the best things is no filing of film, we do a lot of repeat orders so all the film had to be filed.     Repeat orders with CTS are a dream.
And no pin holes, with film every screen was carefully checked and a lot had pinholes, with the CTS we expose without glass and get pinholes on rare occations.
If you have a good carousel you can get your registraton almost perfect with a CTS and this saves a ton of time when setting up.
Having used CTS for close to two years I can only say I regret not listening to people who have beed advising me for years to get a CTS.
One thing I don't think it's any cheaper, correct that you don't need film but you have to price in wax and a replacement head every few years.

[blue moon]

Pierre, good to hear you have a wax unit.
About the process I have to disagree with you.
There are so many things that save time with a CTS it's a no brainer.
I'd say the only consideration is the size of your shop and how many screens you expose. 
A wax CTS can be left off, heat it up and it's ready to go, no continuous problems with clogged heads like the Epson.
We spent hours keeping our heads unblocked.
We get much better screens with our CTS, great dot's and halftones every time.    Obviously like the Epson you have to dial it in.
Maybe the screen maker doesn't have to open a file that is very quite with the Xitron, but the graphics dept have to deal with film, with takes twice as long.
Possibly one of the best things is no filing of film, we do a lot of repeat orders so all the film had to be filed.     Repeat orders with CTS are a dream.
And no pin holes, with film every screen was carefully checked and a lot had pinholes, with the CTS we expose without glass and get pinholes on rare occations.
If you have a good carousel you can get your registraton almost perfect with a CTS and this saves a ton of time when setting up.
Having used CTS for close to two years I can only say I regret not listening to people who have beed advising me for years to get a CTS.
One thing I don't think it's any cheaper, correct that you don't need film but you have to price in wax and a replacement head every few years.

yes, the film takes more time, but it was time in the art department that was only busy 4-5 hours per day. The screen guy was working overtime. For us it made sense to push the films to where we had time. . .

pierre

[Du Manchu]

Great feedback.  Thanks cbJamel.  Those are new vendors to me for rips, carts, chips.  I am leaning towards the T7230 and CADlinks. XL set up...and be on the lookout for long registration issues. 

But first, I am going to hear what MarkDHl has to say about his CTS system.   My primary concern is one of skill set/capacity to run the CTS.   Right now, we just hand them film and they know what to do..usually. 

I’d like to expand the CTS discussion into consistently, or lack thereof.  After years of having some very talented pressmen, post covid, and some new staff we are back to making bad choices of art placement, screen choice, mesh counts, etc.    Could a CTS help with these things, or is it semi-skilled position to operate it?  Can we pre-flight the art files,  so the screen guy is literally just opens the art/screen file and hits print?   Assuming pallet location and shirt placement are standardized, we could nail down out desired print location and mitigate bad print location “choices”, correct?   If I was to buy a CTS and discovered difficulties staffing it, I would HAVE to get there and run, but in reality, I’ d only have time to print film and hand it off (which Pierre spoke to). 

Thanks for the alternate perspectives, as always.

[Maxie]

I run one of Marks units.    Using the Xitron rib it is really easy.
The art department places the graphics in position using a template.
We have one for pocket, front, back, sleeve etc. (I'll be happy to send them to you).
We print to pdf using Acrobat, this is important because it allows you to remove any unwanted colors.
The screen maker enters the file or graphics number and sees the graphics on the screen, you just highlight the file, press a green arrow on the screen  and it transfers to the Douthitt.
We keep our Xitron which has it's own computer next to the CTS, the graphics dept can also upload to the Douthitt.
Put in a screen, press run and off you go.
Choosing mesh count etc is the same as with film, someone has to make a desicsion.     I have friends who have the designer choose mesh counts.    With us the screen maker decides.
Sometimes consults with printers.
Now and again you will have a problem that will need someone with a bit of computer and technical knowledge to sort out, Mark is always available and his service is amazing.
Day to day running is a piece of cake.
CTS is a game changer in running a print shop.