Hirsch/MHM

[jsheridan]

Brandt,
Real quick as this is cell post..

MHM has a warehouse in TN fully stocked with parts and machines.

[blue moon]

I am going to strongly disagree with you on this one. This is the first time that I heard of press being down and needing a tech from Austria to get it up and running. 

Once could be enough to scare me off, I don't have that type of time.....or patience. 

Parts are available in US and come in next day if needed. The only way you are going to get them faster is if you live by the manufacturer and can drive and pick up the part yourself.

I can think of parts that I bet are not sitting on US Soil for many overseas manufactures.  I have heard of people clipping a press with a fork lift, thus needing a print arm.  You think MHM has a spare one for you on US soil for your press?  I bet M&R does.  Take that for what it's worth.  Is it likely you'd need a print arm?  No, but I think it illustrates the point I am making.  Plus who doesn't like to buy from american companies when they can.  I sure do when its possible. 

As far as not doing what is advertised, you might have MHM confused with another brand! What exactly are you talking about here?

My post wasn't really directed at MHM, more a generalization of the drama some have to go through with overseas press suppliers.  This post is a example of that.  No need to read into it, just a observation.  MHM has always been a fine manufacture.  I never said any differently. 

There is a waiting period for a lot of stuff out there. MHM presses are in stock and can be delivered pretty quickly unless something has to be custom made. I will give you that if it has to be shipped from Austria it will take longer to get here, but for the most part press purchases are not an impulse buy and are delivered when needed. What do you know about ppl waiting? I'd like to know. I am planning on another press soon and based on my experiences there is no doubt what I am getting, but again, I am a sample of one and would like to know what somebody else had issues with.

Again my post was a generalization of overseas press suppliers.  Seems many of them are 8-12 weeks at best, a year or more, or never at worst.  I think that in itself is enough to make me stay away.  I am a small timer and I printed enough in the time some have waited for their press that I could have paid for mine in cash in that time frame.  So it's food for thought.  MHM I am sure is on the up and up though and presses are actually delivered when ordered and roughly on time. 

There might not be much hard evidence out there, but ppl I talked to, even if they were not running MHM's, agreed that it is the most reliable press on the market. That translates into less down time than anybody else and if you add the shorter setup times it does produce more per dollar than the competition. I will absolutely agree that in a case of some catastrophic failure it might take longer to get it back up, but those are so rare that I have not heard of one ever. All of the issues we have heard of before this one are caused by the operators rather than the press/manufacturer. The customer with the press that was dropped is the first ever I heard that it was MHM's fault. This is not to say that their product is perfect, as nobody's is, but as far as reliability they beat anything else on the market. Your personal choice then becomes, do you want a press that will break more often and the support is going to be faster or something that will break less and there is a short delay in getting the support.

pierre

I don't think anyone has any hard data to say who is the most reliable.  But M&R is always in that discussion near or at the top to anyone I talk to.  Also when deciding who is most reliable, it would fail me to not take into consideration who can repair a issue the fastest.  M&R has more support staff than anyone...period.  M&R's support team is larger than many press manufacture companies probably......

I think you know my over all point, and its not directly about MHM.  Don't have to defend them so hard.  I think they are a great press, it was even the first press I looked at.

thank you for taking the time to answer this and 'am glad we cleared up the important issues.

pierre

[GraphicDisorder]

Brandt,
Real quick as this is cell post..

MHM has a warehouse in TN fully stocked with parts and machines.

I can see everyone clearly missed the actual point of my post.  The post was barely about MHM..... 

I will try to be more obvious...lol.

[Frog]

I can see everyone clearly missed the actual point of my post.  The post was barely about MHM..... 

I will try to be more obvious...lol.

Yeah, but you see what posts praising M&R spawn!

[244]

Here is a little input from a competitor. MHM as a whole have been a viable competitor here and abroad. They as the norm have not used false statements to push their wares and from what we see usually deliver somewhat close to their delivery dates. Just like here at M&R getting parts to another country can at times be an issue due to customs, duties, and freight schedules. That is why we build machines for Europe in Europe and follow metrics in the countries that are using them. Finding an air cylinder or fitting, etc that is metric in the States is not impossible but not as easy as US standard. The old MHM was a fair competitor and through Hirsch did a reasonable job servicing their customers. The new owners I have no idea how they will be. Am I biased about M&R absolutely and truly believe we are the best there is in this industry when it comes to equipment, service, and performance. When looking at all the other players I would say MHM is #2 with all the others a great distance behind. Just my opinion for what its worth.

[GraphicDisorder]

I can see everyone clearly missed the actual point of my post.  The post was barely about MHM..... 

I will try to be more obvious...lol.

Yeah, but you see what posts praising M&R spawn!

LOL. 

[Dottonedan]

Here is a little input from a competitor. MHM as a whole have been a viable competitor here and abroad. They as the norm have not used false statements to push their wares and from what we see usually deliver somewhat close to their delivery dates. Just like here at M&R getting parts to another country can at times be an issue due to customs, duties, and freight schedules. That is why we build machines for Europe in Europe and follow metrics in the countries that are using them. Finding an air cylinder or fitting, etc that is metric in the States is not impossible but not as easy as US standard. The old MHM was a fair competitor and through Hirsch did a reasonable job servicing their customers. The new owners I have no idea how they will be. Am I biased about M&R absolutely and truly believe we are the best there is in this industry when it comes to equipment, service, and performance. When looking at all the other players I would say MHM is #2 with all the others a great distance behind. Just my opinion for what its worth.

Rich,

I think we can all recognize, you are clearly an upstanding individual and we thank you for your contribution here.

Dot-Tone-Dan

[ebscreen]

PC! MAC! FORD! CHEVY!

 Opposite of buyers remorse

Jeez what did I do. People really get their panties in a bunch over this sort of thing. A critique on your purchase or your posession is not an attack on your personally. What is the spill on aisle 5 I missed?

My main point was that even the dude from Austria couldn't fix the problem. This is a 1 press shop, and they had
already dismantled their old press (TAS) to make room for the new one. Obviously disconcerting enough that the guy was calling around to other MHM shops to ask opinions. I said straight up if you never want to be in this situation again buy an M&R. It's the same logic as not buying a rare Yugoslavian truck to deliver lumber in the US every day. Even if the truck is badass and makes cool noises. Common as dirt can be a very good thing.

I'll post more when not tapping on a phone.

[inkman996]

I would bet that in any manufacturing business not just ours that every major player has had issues with a product on site, its machinery and S H I T happens. Rich is a stand up guy and I would think he would admit some where in their long history of equipment sales a bad piece went out the door. Hell I know of a press down in GA sold by barnes that was bad on delivery and never was replaced. It sounds to me like MHM is bending over backwards to right the wrong to the point of now losing money let alone making any profit off the original sale.

EB is right tho i learned the hard way there is a lot to be said dealing with a American company with a long history of support and reliability backing it up.

[GraphicDisorder]

I said straight up if you never want to be in this situation again buy an M&R. It's the same logic as not buying a rare Yugoslavian truck to deliver lumber in the US every day. Even if the truck is badass and makes cool noises. Common as dirt can be a very good thing.

This makes way to much sense, people will ignore it.   

[Screened Gear]

I am amazed at you guys and the way your acting about this situation. Even if I didn't have a MHM I would not look at this as a bad mark on MHM. We really shouldn't even be talking about it unless the guy in California is here. We don't have all the facts. We have to be very careful about what we say on a open forum like this. You can hurt a manufacture for a long time by saying the wrong thing. I am not saying to lie or not tell the facts. Just don't say things you know nothing about. Saying MHM can't service a machine because parts come from over seas. Many of the Press have over sea parts even the ones made here. It has been pointed out that MHM has plenty of parts here in the US to cover any day to day issues that their presses may have.

Why whenever there is a post about autos all we hear is how great M&R's service is and we should buy them because M&R can fix what they make.

This was a post about a situation a guy is having with a MHM. In this same situation what would M&R do different?

[GraphicDisorder]

This was a post about a situation a guy is having with a MHM.

I seen the post more like:

This was a post about a situation a guy is having with getting exactly what he ordered from a overseas manufacture and to make it more complicated the manufacture has visited and after 2 presses its still not right.  I didn't even use MHM in my original reply, nor do I think they are a bad company in any way, never said anything remotely like that.  However, there seems to be a lot of issues with presses coming from overseas (not specifically MHM but in general).  Be it sales/service/support/or the actual press working like it's suppose to.  So I was just touching on that. 

Distance clearly complicates things...... 

I think the reason you see a lot of M&R posting is because thats what most people use.  Laws of averages.  If as a whole the world sells more red cars, you will see more red cars.  If M&R sells the most presses and those customers are happy, I am sure you will hear a lot about that.

[Screened Gear]

This was a post about a situation a guy is having with a MHM.

I seen the post more like:

This was a post about a situation a guy is having with getting exactly what he ordered from a overseas manufacture and to make it more complicated the manufacture has visited and after 2 presses its still not right.  I didn't even use MHM in my original reply, nor do I think they are a bad company in any way, never said anything remotely like that.  However, there seems to be a lot of issues with presses coming from overseas (not specifically MHM but in general).  Be it sales/service/support/or the actual press working like it's suppose to.  So I was just touching on that. 

Distance clearly complicates things...... 

I think the reason you see a lot of M&R posting is because thats what most people use.  Laws of averages.  If as a whole the world sells more red cars, you will see more red cars.  If M&R sells the most presses and those customers are happy, I am sure you will hear a lot about that.

Brandt,

I am not trying to start anything here. I am just curious, You sound like you know M&Rs service really well. What would M&R do different with their local service?

[Dottonedan]

Also note, that the "spill in Isle 5 was pertaining to a certain beast to "who shall not be named" that registered under a fake name again but has been captured and euthanized.  That might be where you are reading of some pooh pooh. Nobody else is rally saying anything horrible.  The bad man in gone now.

[Evo]

Most any press manufacturer can make a bad apple. One that gives the customer, dealer AND the manufacturer an ulcer. Unfortunately for MHM it sounds like a bad apple was sent to replace a busted machine. Perfect crap-storm.

No to say that a company like M&R could ever prevent this, I think most any manufacturer is vulnerable in this regard. It's how quick the problem gets resolved that separates the true competitors from the posers. If required you could have a small army of M&R techs at your door for the cost of flying in a single Austrian specialist.

This is the same reason I use (and endorse) DW drums and hardware - they are the best possible option out there. Great sound, consistent build quality, reliable and parts can be had at most any drum shop on earth. Not the cheapest (AT ALL) but for the cost of a good custom built boutique kit you also have world wide product support.

Not to mention they make the top end drums from scratch right here in California. I've even toured the factory. Much harder to do this with Japanese or German brands.

Also, not unlike M&R, they understand a systems-built approach to their product line. One stop shopping.