Saati Lazer Exposure unit.

[zanegun08]

Laser unit is in place, install tomorrow. I'll let you guys know some initial feedback on it once we start firing up the laser.

Rad!  No consumables for the win, and ideally it can use your existing 1 bit tiffs for the wax unit so you don't have to redo all your art that you have already done, just a matter of aligning them on the screen correctly.

I'm excited to see this, and inline DTG at ISS this year.

I hope in 2 more years, this technology gets faster, and comes down in prices, although that doesn't really matter with no consumables.  This year we have spent ~$5300 on wax, which averages to about .10 cents per screen although we do a lot of screens double sided.

Very little maintenance needed in the 3 years we've had the unit, but over the span of 5 years if we buy the same amount of wax and fingers crossed we don't have any major maintenance costs or print head replacements needed, then we will be at around $77k for the cost of ownership and consumables.  That 90k isn't out of the ballpark for "0" matienece and 0 consumables if only the speed was a little faster.  Also can't do more than one image on the screen unless you set it up in art first (unless they have a function to gang images in software)

Anyhow, love new tech

[ZooCity]

Just installed 3 new print heads - $4500.........
the tech was a few bucks.....
that's twice this year.........
thousands in Toner a year..........THOUSANDS of dollars
constant cleaning, constant adjusting valves, constant everything....
(we have 2 I-Image 3 head machines)
Don't get me wrong - I-Image is the way to go for speed and accuracy
film............like getting my artists to use a rotary phone
Can't look back, we aren't going that way

I could care less about a dot past 55 lpi
most work here is 2 over 3 and all spot work

let me count the ways.

Ron, is that twice in a year you have had to install new heads on your unit or once each?  What I'm asking is how often and at what cost are you replacing heads?  It seems that some CTS users, both of wax and ink, get lucky and don't need a head for years, others tear through them.  I lost track of the printheads our unit went through in a year.

Zane makes the point that I have in my mind regarding the laser tech v. masking- what's the annual operating for heads/tech/masking consumables?  Roi looks a lot better on the laser machine with only a possible need for tech support v. the masking media plus the basically disposable print heads if your annual costs are up there.  Ours were with CTS or rather they would've been had the machine not been under warranty.  Unless you are a larger or multi shift operation pumping out so many screens per shift that the attrition of masking media, print heads, you and your staff's time spent troubleshooting and tech visits is worth it I think tech like this laser unit is worth holding out for. 

Following along to see how this thing performs.

[Ron Pierson]

Hey Zoo


Well - that is changing all three heads once this year and two others once - total of 5
we do about 550 - 600 screens a day - two shifts.
screen room only open for 10 or so hours in a day.
washout and re-coat done in 8 hours.

RP

[LuckyFlyinROUSH]

Our I-Image has gone through 9 print heads in 2 years. That's right. 15k two years in print heads.
Our last 3 heads lasted less than 6 months.

Machine only gets used 4 hours a day, 4 days a week.

We are waiting to see if they are going to try to warranty the last set somehow as the damn things didn't even last 6 months. It's ludicrous. There has to be a manufacturing defect with the last set of heads.

[zanegun08]

Hey Zoo


Well - that is changing all three heads once this year and two others once - total of 5
we do about 550 - 600 screens a day - two shifts.
screen room only open for 10 or so hours in a day.
washout and re-coat done in 8 hours.

RP

That's an obscene amount of screens.  Is it still fun at that point?

This technology will have to come a long way to support a business like yours, or you'll need an army of exposure units as I can't see this being sped up exponentially unless emulsion chemistry evolves to accommodate.  Since you are exposing the full screen, it will have to always do the full screen, while wax or inkjet masking speed is limited by the speed of the print head which can increase over time, or adding more print heads (I-Image style), larger print heads, and speeding them up.

But for the laser unit to go faster, it either means more light arrays, which would increase cost of the machine, and maybe lose accuracy.

Anyhow, super interesting tech, but at that many screens per day, you may just not be the right demographic and be stuck with replacing expensive prints heads long into the future.

Can't wait to see at ISS.

[ebscreen]

Laser for the imaged area and a different faster scanning lightsource for the non-imaged area.

[Ron Pierson]

Hey All

sure - still fun!! The fun is to see if there are any improvements along the way that will fix the bottom line. We have identified MANY of those. We have lots of starlights.
It's quicker to remove a screen from an I-Image and run another while a starlight is burning. It is more cost effective if they run simultaneous.

[ZooCity]

Ron I remembered vaguely that you did a lot of screens but dang a rang that's a heavy load per shift. 

I agree that the laser units would need an emulsion with a spectral match in sensitivity. 

Can you imagine just feeding screens into a unit as fast as you can and them coming out exposed?   I feel like that would be amazing in line with a resolving unit.

[zanegun08]

Can you imagine just feeding screens into a unit as fast as you can and them coming out exposed?   I feel like that would be amazing in line with a resolving unit.

If you are in Europe you can get the STM-TEX, and SET IT, AND FORGET IT!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k9prR8itm6k

You can get one in the US too, but I don't know about support, and they are mucho money.

Though as labor continues to rise this tech gets much more attractive.  Combine the SAATI Exposure with the STM-TEX automated workflow.

[ZooCity]

I love that video, I watch it a couple times a year.   Too bad that frame profile hasn't caught on in the states.

I think an expo unit like the one being discussed could be paired with a simple, in-line resolving system for a poor man's version of this. 

[SPX]

Saw many years ago a smt printer laser imaging their screens.  Maybe 10 years ago.
Cannot remember the make.

How about this unit:
http://www.digitalscreenprinting.com/#about-us

[zanegun08]

Too bad that frame profile hasn't caught on in the states.

Off Topic, but there is a company that makes them in the US, I got a sample frame, the issue was the thickness of the frame was to slim for our M&R presses to close down on without modification, making running standard square, and the beveled frames simultaneously difficult if not impossible without major modification.

I can look up the company next week if you are interested send me an email.  The ended up only being a few dollars more per frame if I remember correctly, but as typical, they were far from Oregon so shipping was a killer for us on them and not being "press ready" at no fault to the screen manufacturer though.

Edit to include the link - http://www.offcontact.com/screens-home

[LuckyFlyinROUSH]

Hey Danny!

Did ya fall in? I'm excited to hear if it works?!

[screenprintguy]

Off topic, but I'd really like to see one of these things in action.
My off topic thing is hitting on the guys that have head print head issues on their I-Images. I've been really struggling with using certain emulsions. Chromaline emulsions reacted great, but most murakami emulsions have lines/banding looking deals when imaging which translates to time and pain in the arse beating on the screen to rinse out. I was just told Friday that a new UV ink for the I-Images has been in testing and should be released soon that will not only cure the issues with bad reactions on come emulsions to also not drying in the heads if the heads aren't wet capped. Once we had to change our print head, I was given the advice to cap the head in pink solution every night, if the unit is off for any time beyond a couple days, flush the head with the pink solution, cap it in pink solution as this is how the heads are stored before installed in the machines. We have used all the inks from starting with K, to D, to D2, and now D2A. The new one I think will be called Q, not sure, but I know of a guy a couple hours from me with a new unit that had issues with his print heads, he had an air vent near the unit that blue air into the unit getting by his cap and drying out the head. They replaced the head and he was having the same things I'm having with T9, so that led the tech to see it wasn't isolated. Single head units seem to see more of the issues on emulsion because of just the one head. My currrent work around is 12+ setting, but I want to be in a position to run 6+ and get the max speed. Anyways, my point is that not only will the new ink cure those interaction problems that some of us deal with having lines in our freshly printed images on certain emulsions, it supposedly doesn't dry in the head fast like D2a does. I know if I walk away from my unit for more than 20 minutes, the D2a will totally clog and I have to run a butt ton of cleanings to get it going again, yeah frustrating, but I just try to remember if I'm not tossing a screen right in, Cap that bad boy. Sorry to stray from the laser topic, maybe this one split at one time and I didn't see it. But M&R is working to resolve the issues with the inks that some have had.

Someone needs to put some videos up of the laser thing doing it's deal =)

[Colin]

They replaced the head and he was having the same things I'm having with T9, so that led the tech to see it wasn't isolated.
Someone needs to put some videos up of the laser thing doing it's deal =)

I use the T9 emulsion here - with diazo added for anti halation - and I have zero issues with banding unless there is a head issue.  Then we just clean and its good to go.  But its also a single head and we run whatever the best print quality is.

Have you talked with Murakami at all about the emulsion issues?

Still want the lazers...