Tape Sucks!

[DannyGruninger]

After watching trash can after trash can after trash can go out my shop daily with screen tape in it I've finally had enough. I've made the switch and have sold all the rollers we have here as I'm planning to switch to perm blockout static frames. I know we have some guys on the forum running this type of setup so I'd love to hear some feedback. Zane from OSI gave me some great info already, but would like to hear if anyone else has experience. We run auto reclaim machine and my main concern is the ability of the perm blockout holding up over time. I really dont want to invest in 500+ screens right now only to see the blockout fail down the road.

If anyone is using tapeless screens I would love to hear your experience, whos your using, what type of reclaim, etc.


any help is appreciated!

Danny

[Nation03]

We use the tapeless screens from spot color. They use the red perm blockout, not sure on the brand. I have some older screens and we reclaim manually and they hold up great. Tension has held really well also. There can be some pinholes in the blockout, but if you use a scoop coater that overlaps the blockout, that shouldn't really be an issue.

I still use tape on the frame because our press likes to fling ink a bit so the tape helps keep things off the frames and make's cleanup a little easier for us still. Eventually I'd like to get away from using tape as well. I still gang images depending on the size of the design so taping them off is necessary sometimes.

Overall, they are the best statics i've used and the frames hold up much better with the blockout.

[Frog]

Won't work for most of you with dip tanks, but I keep the tape on for many jobs before removal and replacement.

[3Deep]

Also Danny if you want to toss the tape you can always buy some Aqua Block, that stuff works great, it holds up to water base inks and discharge inks and is a muthaF to remove.  so I'm you don't want to remove it so using it around the edges of your screens will replace tape.

[T Shirt Farmer]

We have been tapeless for a year on our Shurloc frames and have the process down. I cant tell you how cool it is not dumping hundreds of rolls of tape into the dumpster and how much time and money it saves. I will post some pics of how we do ours next week.

[Stinkhorn Press]

Also interested.
We have no-tape 16 statics coming our way next week to try for the first time (Intech). We pay full price for 3" PMI quick-rip tape and have for years. It's amazingly pricey (but still worth to us VS tape that is ANY LESS easy to use). Works out to roughly $0.25 per screen. At $5 for the blockout, we're looking at a 20 cycle cost breakeven (assuming ZERO tape usage in the meantime, not likely).

We do a manual reclaim.

My main question/concern (besides longevity) is emulsion build up where it meets the blockout. Does it build up? Does it make the scoop coater stagger at all? Did you need to buy a wider coater if you're only doing a single pass of emulsion?

[Maxie]

We stretch our own screens, when we glue them to the frame  we put tape about 3/4" from them edge of the frame and glue up to the tape.
This gives a permanently blocked out area of 3/4".     Th glue works well as a permanent block out.
If you buy pre stretched frames you could ask the people you buy them from to do what we do.
We still put tape on the inside of the screen, the length only  when printing. This makes cleaning much easier.     It hard to clean in the corners.

[Homer]

Also interested.
We have no-tape 16 statics coming our way next week to try for the first time (Intech). We pay full price for 3" PMI quick-rip tape and have for years. It's amazingly pricey (but still worth to us VS tape that is ANY LESS easy to use). Works out to roughly $0.25 per screen. At $5 for the blockout, we're looking at a 20 cycle cost breakeven (assuming ZERO tape usage in the meantime, not likely).

We do a manual reclaim.

My main question/concern (besides longevity) is emulsion build up where it meets the blockout. Does it build up? Does it make the scoop coater stagger at all? Did you need to buy a wider coater if you're only doing a single pass of emulsion?

that was one of our issues with it. I'm sure it's better now when applied by the professionals like Spot Color. The "scoop coat stutter" and water splash back in reclaim were the biggest issues, so we stopped using it.  We haven't used tape in years...and rarely blockout. we use a wider scoop coater and S mesh statics, d'hell with tape. (and rollers too)

[T Shirt Farmer]

Here is what ours look like - mark mesh count before applying blockout

[ericheartsu]

are you all just blocking out the file notes? that's the only thing we still tape up.

[ZooCity]

All our 25x36 frames are GSF's Elite frames with murakami s mesh.  Fantastic so far.  The only thing I'm waiting for is to upgrade our small auto to a 25x36 format and we're going to go that direction.

We are not automated on reclaim, dip tank here. No issues thus far but this format does not get the heavy use that 23x31 does in our shop.

I share your hatred for the tape (and not mention labor) waste.  Been wanting to make the move for years, following this!

[LuckyFlyinROUSH]

We use tape less screens from Nortec. I think I posted a bad experience, but Nazdar cleaned it up made it right. Make sure you specify high tension, and check them over when they come in. Some guys get sloppy applying the caulking and its a nightmare to try to scrape ink out of the screens. Send them back.

We love them. 1.5" on either side, 2" on top and bottom. The Uni-Kote barely covers it on all four sides.

[dirkdiggler]

We tried and didn't like it, if you are auto reclaim it may be awesome, but if you shoot it with a pressure washer....get ready for a huge mess when you hit the squeegee side!  Our experience anyway.

[Mr Tees!!]

I tried a few of the perma-tape screens and just didnt care for it in the long run. Emulsion is much harder to reclaim off the surface of it. If you dont get all the emulsion off, it can build up in spots and make coating a stuttery, sketchy affair. That said, one thing i did like about it was how it added reinforecement and protection in the most vulnerable areas of the mesh, especially so on fragile S-mesh frames. I will also say that I tried a few from different suppliers, and SpotColor Supply produced the best ones, by far.

We use a 19" coater used to coat a 23x31 this leaves a coating gap of less than an inch on each side of the frame. I recommend the Monster Max coater, which has thin, low proflle plates for end caps, allowing you to get close while coating without hitting the side of the frame.

Yknow that emulsion "bead" that runs lengthwise on each side of the frame after coating? What we do, as we are coating, is take a small cut piece of squeegee rubber (1.5-2 inches wide), and "scrape" that emulsion bead in a diagonal fashion to spread it across the uncoated gap at the side of the screen. One scrape across both sides on the inside of the frame, and the same on the outside of the frame. We then scrape the emulsion off the rubber back into the coater.
   Yes it takes a bit more time coating, but no more so that an additional step of blocking out and/or taping screens. Plus, no more tape or blockout to buy! We have also noticed a nearly 20% increase in the number of of screens you can coat per gallon of emulsion, those beads apparently consume more emulsion than you would imagine. Also, the screens are much easier to reclaim without those heavy beads in place.

With no tape and blockout to deal with, I now do color changes in my washout sink. Scrub with bean-e-doo (I find it rinses the cleanest), rinse with water, a quick dry, and back on the press.

I will try to get a video together next time I coat screens.

[Stinkhorn Press]

With no tape and blockout to deal with, I now do color changes in my washout sink. Scrub with bean-e-doo (I find it rinses the cleanest), rinse with water, a quick dry, and back on the press.

nice! color changes suck on an auto when you are used to doing it on a manual press.

Yknow that emulsion "bead" that runs lengthwise on each side of the frame after coating? What we do, as we are coating, is take a small cut piece of squeegee rubber (1.5-2 inches wide), and "scrape" that emulsion bead in a diagonal fashion to spread it across the uncoated gap at the side of the screen. One scrape across both sides on the inside of the frame, and the same on the outside of the frame. We then scrape the emulsion off the rubber back into the coater.

we clean up the beads (bent clean up card) but we NEVER add it back to the coater. it always has picked up some crud and will contaminate our coater. extra waste, but worth the lack of problems downstream for us.
using the bead to cover any gaps might be something to try.