Print/Screen Selection Advice

[FleekT21]

Quick opinions here are very much appreciated! Running this 6/1 (small 50 piece) job on our auto this week. We have 1 flash and 1 flashback (I never used it) 8/10 Sabre. Attached is the proof for this job. These will be printed on numerous color dark shirts- all 100% performance Poly Augusta Kinergy shirts. I'll probably be running Top Score White with Rio colors, maybe Top Score black to finish. I just want to get your take. BTW- artwork will get cleaned up slightly. This was supplied by client.

Seps- I have white underbasing all colors except black. All underbase has a very small trap. Right now, I have it set up as a 1 color white probably PFP on 225S. I'm not sure if that will be enough white to prevent dye migration- so not sure if we need a bleed blocker gray OR use the black to underbase everything? I tend to think the black underbase would be a bad idea since it flashes super quick.. Wondering if you guys would use a highlight white.. And going butt-to-butt registration on all top colors.

Screen Selection- White 225S or 180S, Black- 180S or 225S, Top Colors- 225S, 230, or 305

Print Order:
Rotation 1) White- P + F + Roll
Rotation 2) White- P + F, Blue, Yellow, Beige
Rotation 3) F + Red, Black

I'm worried I'll need to sneak in a flash after the red. I can usually print a few top colors without flashing but not great luck over 2 colors in a row. Tight screens, light pressure, long stroke. Let me know how some of you guys would take a stab at this. I usually don't through any soft hand into our Rio colors since they are relatively soft and easy to work with. However, if it will help on picking up- I'm all for that. Thx guys

[mk162]

On that color shirt you shouldn't need 2 flashes.

We would print it like so:

1. black (225s)
2. white (180s)
flash
4. red (230)
5. blue (230)
6. flesh (230)
7. yellow (230)
8. white (230)

If you still wanted to PFP the white you could, but I would drop it to a 225s.

Single stroke those top colors with a good speed and a 5-10 degree angle on the squeegee blade.  I don't see why you would need 3 rotations on this.

[FleekT21]

Thanks for the input. I wouldn't think to put black first but may be worth a shot. I'm assuming butt to butt in the artwork?

[mk162]

Yes, but a lot of times I will put a slight outline between the black and white so they don't get muddled.  It's hard to see on a medium colored shirt.

[Prince Art]

If you have concerns about being able to hold butt registration well enough, a very small amount of inside trap on the black could help. That's a plus to printing & flashing black under everything.

I'd probably print the same order mk162 listed, except I might start with the 1st white, then black. Then flash, + all else. That would allow minimal black trap on all. If printing black first, I wouldn't trap under white, to avoid blur where black & white meet.

The only reason I see to use a 2nd flash is if you've got ink sticking to subsequent screens & affecting the print.

[alan802]

I'd run it like this, Revolver/2 Revolutions because I think you're going to have issues because of no cool down heads:
1st Revolution
1. Black-180 (all mesh thin thread)
2. Base-135-150
2. Flashback
4. Red-225
6. Flash
7. Yellow-225

2nd Revolution
2. Flash
3. Blue 225
5. Flesh
6. Flash
8. Top White

Not having cool downs is going to exacerbate any buildup issues and if you have really good spot colors built for WOW printing then you'll be fine.  But also having a great underbase white with very low tack and fast flashing then you can print directly after it.  If you don't have a good wet on wet black, print the black 1st on your 2nd revolution which would have yellow buildup to watch out for but it would get rid of the chance of problems with a bad black. 

If you can get away with printing it all without cool downs then I'd do this:
1. Black
2. Base
2. Flashback
3. Blue
4. Red
5. Flesh
6. Flash
7. Yellow
8. Top White

Not all black inks are built to run 1st or wet on wet.  We run black down 1st all the time, did 400 shirts yesterday with black 1st and had no buildup on the underbase or scorching under the black under the flash. Yeah, there are things that can hurt you with using this technique, and if it's a 2 or 3 color and you have an auto don't worry about where you put the black and don't worry about printing wet on wet, just flash between colors and get the job done.  I know some might disagree with me in this scenario, a 3 color on darks on a 10 color auto w/ 2 flashes, but put a color before your 2 flashes and your 3rd color on the last head and run your flashes.  You'll have much fewer issues to look out for and to slow you down.  It does cost money to run your flashes but if you're running flashes that cost that much you should look into better flashes .  Even a simple 2 color on white shirts, we'll flash between the colors.  I used to always run a job like that on head 9 and 10, wet on wet, just because I wanted to be able to print wow whenever I wanted.  But now I'll just separate the colors by a flash and I only worry about buildup when I have to.  We print so many high color counts and do wow printing so often I don't need to prove anything these days. 

[zanegun08]

I like Alan's order in revolution mode,

You could probably get away with just 1 pass, but for 50 pieces go around twice and it'll ad what, 15 more minutes to do it right and keep it crispy?

I would do the same, but move the

1st Revolution
1 - Base + Flashback
3 - Red
5 - Flash
6 - Yellow
8 - Top White

2nd Revolution
1 - Flashback
2 - Blue
4 - Flesh
5 - Flash
7 - Black (print 2nd to last to clean up the details)
8 - Top White (print it twice so it's super blingy, and you have the opportunity)

So your screens would be

1 - Base / Flashback
2 - Blue
3 - Red
4 - Flesh
5 - Flash*
6 - Yellow
7 - Black
8 - White

Then the only problem may be no cool down after the 2nd flash on the blue and yellow, but the blue and yellow is a small detail, and it if picked up a bit it would just add to the sloshy water effect

[mk162]

Maybe I am on the outside, but I HATE running 2 flashes.  I did it the other day to get an extra layer of glow in the dark over a white base and a glow white and glow gray.  Other than that, it's been a long time since we've run 2 flashes.

To me it's a bandaid.  It's a medium color shirt.

[FleekT21]

Thanks for the input guys- all great stuff. The shirts will be varied in color to dark navy + these are all 100% poly. I'll set it up this week and see what works best. I'll try to get some pics posted if I need some help. Thanks again!

[FleekT21]

Quick question about bringing discharge into the mix. I've got a very similar job to this- 6 spot colors but on cotton black. I'd like to use a discharge white underbase. I've never run discharge as a base there than regular spot colors. Petabytes just say we ran this job posted with a discharge UB. Would you print that first, then run black or would you flash the discharge before running black and other colors? Techniciay it
Could all go wet on wet right? Maybe with a top plastisol white..

[tonypep]

Depending on the design you might be able to skip the black alltogether but yes you can print in this fashion providing you do the due dillegence for DC. Straight white as a base is a nono. And try to always use one flash. The DC base minizes/eliminates smearing on top colors

[Sbrem]

I'm in the boat with MK162 as well, but because of the press we have, 10/12, and we would print black first as well. If you had to print some black halftones on top the order would change, but I see no reason for that with this design. No cool downs, then run slowly, it's still a lot faster than manual...

Steve

[FleekT21]

Sounds great guys! Definitely appreciate the feedback. Here is a quick vid of an 800 piece job today 5 color:
https://www.facebook.com/chris.studer1/videos/10102099032429386/