Mlink in the building.

[3Deep]

Not to be a jerk here Brandt, but I'd love to hear what trouble other's are having with there Brother machine's that use them everyday...are they having your same trouble's, plus with you having the M&R equipment to compare you just about know which one is going to get a thumbs up.  After all is said and done and the Mlink is really that much better machine and less hassle to work with it should give it a big time jump in sells cause the white ink is what makes or breaks this machines now oh and ink cost.  40k is a good hunk change, but from your testing it might be the less cost down the line, I'm still sitting on the fence here.

[244]

Not to be a jerk here Brandt, but I'd love to hear what trouble other's are having with there Brother machine's that use them everyday...are they having your same trouble's, plus with you having the M&R equipment to compare you just about know which one is going to get a thumbs up.  After all is said and done and the Mlink is really that much better machine and less hassle to work with it should give it a big time jump in sells cause the white ink is what makes or breaks this machines now oh and ink cost.  40k is a good hunk change, but from your testing it might be the less cost down the line, I'm still sitting on the fence here.

The one reason I ask Brandt to accept our press was the fact that he would be brutally honest and unbiased. If we had done This at M&R I know there would be a bunch of people jumping on the bandwagon saying this was sales hype by M&R. Take it for what it's worth. I truly believe Brandt is the normal user experience and I had no problem putting out product out there with the risk it was not the best long term bargain. This is typical of what we are seeing in the field. Do what is best for you. It's not what you pay. It's what you get for what you pay. Just a FYI.

[blue moon]

It's not what you pay. It's what you get for what you pay.

I LOVE this line!!! mind if I use it in the future?

pierre

[GraphicDisorder]

Not to be a jerk here Brandt, but I'd love to hear what trouble other's are having with there Brother machine's that use them everyday...are they having your same trouble's, plus with you having the M&R equipment to compare you just about know which one is going to get a thumbs up.  After all is said and done and the Mlink is really that much better machine and less hassle to work with it should give it a big time jump in sells cause the white ink is what makes or breaks this machines now oh and ink cost.  40k is a good hunk change, but from your testing it might be the less cost down the line, I'm still sitting on the fence here.

If anyone doesn't believe I am telling the truth my shop is wide open and BOTH machines are sitting here doing nothing this whole week. Come by and throw shirts though them and share your opinion. 

I have only had a little trouble out of the Brother, which I have detailed.  The point of today's posts is your have 1-2hrs weekly tube cleaning to do each Monday. That's a lot more time than the M&R is requiring and early in this thread some where all about talking about speed differences (which we've shown prints both faster and slower off each). So now as we look at the up keep and we see differences.

I am not going to give the M&R the thumbs up just to give it the thumbs up regardless what anyone may believe. I bought the Brother, egg on my face by pointing out the M&R seems better so far overall. If anything many would suggest id be biased to the Brother, after all I already bought it and its paid in full. I am actually upset that the M&R is better so far, because if this pans out that way I will want to buy it. That's not good for the check book buddy. I was/am rooting for the Brother because thats where I put my dollars. Many argue here we all defend the things we buy, well if that was the case wouldn't the Brother be printing real gold bars and id be retired already?

As of today, right now, this is what I see-
Brother is a lower cost machine, so Brother has the advantage there by a lot.

Speed is a push, each printing some prints faster/slower than each other.

Quality is a push, each printing detail better and worse than the other on various prints.

Ink cost is drastically cheaper on the M&R.

Ink use is a good bit more so far on the Brother, Brother suggests they can get us closer to M&R's ink use, but even if it was the same the M&R ink is 1/3rd the cost.  They say we are using too much ink, maybe so, we played with those settings in training PRIOR to M&R's machine showing up and we selected settings that we felt looked the best, which had nothing to do with Ink cost. First and foremost we want a quality print.  Maybe they will have some tricks to make the ink use/costs closer which I welcome.

Maintenance seems to be a good bit more on the Brother, highlighted by the weekly 1-2hr tube cleaning and so on.

Issues, we've seen on the Brother 1 day with prints looking a bit wrong even though the nozzle checks looked good I still have no real idea why that one happened but basically went away the next day. Then today where we haven't been able to achieve a clear nozzle check even after tube cleaning, nozzle checks, test prints, power clean, normal clean, etc.

Waste tank is a lot more full than the M&R.

Keep in mind when Rich asked me to do this I bluntly told him I would pull no punches or sugar coat anything on this machine. If this thing blows up tomorrow you cats will know. Brother I am sure isn't thrilled about this but I have been as transparent as I can be and I have pointed out I like their machine just fine and I am not upset at them or Nazdar.

I did similar to this thread when I got my first Auto, as it was my opinion at the time there wasn't enough people talking about them in detail.

[TCT]

Maintenance was the main reason we ditched the DTG side of things. Now we didn't have either of the machines in this thread, but it was 15min every morning. Printed nice, but when you are use to screen printing or running a auto DTG for us was WAY too much of a time eater if we didn't have shirts lined up for the whole day.

It's not what you pay. It's what you get for what you pay. Just a FYI.

While I agree with this, you kinda skewed the situation here. If someone is looking to get a better machine that is 60% more expensive initially, sometimes that extra initial price is hard to swing. Be it a approved lease amount, cash on hand, whatever. But if you are coming in and GIVING the nicer machine to someone for free for 90 days or whatever, that makes the whole thing waaaaaaaaay different. Who wouldn't go with the initially higher priced machine then???

Darryl/3Deep who is looking into a DTG right now would probably love a free 90 days of printing/time to make more off offering DTG. But is that available to all? Otherwise this is a good head head comparison of print quality, but nothing else.

[GraphicDisorder]

Darryl/3Deep who is looking into a DTG right now would probably love a free 90 days of printing/time to make more off offering DTG. But is that available to all? Otherwise this is a good head head comparison of print quality, but nothing else.

Darryl doesn't have another machine does he? I am pretty certain that is the only reason I had the offer of the Mlink to compare.

I am confused how this thread is only valid comparison for print quality...nothing else?  Print speed, print quality, ink costs, ease of use, waste ink, this goes on and on with comparisons does it not? I mean I would hope many would compare more than just print quality.... 

[TCT]

Darryl/3Deep who is looking into a DTG right now would probably love a free 90 days of printing/time to make more off offering DTG. But is that available to all? Otherwise this is a good head head comparison of print quality, but nothing else.

Darryl doesn't have another machine does he? I am pretty certain that is the only reason I had the offer of the Mlink to compare.

I am confused how this thread is only valid comparison for print quality...nothing else?  Print speed, print quality, ink costs, ease of use, waste ink, this goes on and on with comparisons does it not? I mean I would hope many would compare more than just print quality....

You are comparing 2 machines, one is 60% more expensive.

Try comparing 2 other machines that have a 60% price difference, the M-Link and the M-Link Plus, which one do you think will be a better investment in the long run??

[3Deep]

Alex you are correct, we went to the show and thought we found the machine we wanted to buy, turns out I didn't have all the info I needed and the machine I thought was good has bad reviews' and the one I like was price to high for us and the other machine would cost us a ton ink wasted ink.  I'm not knocking the Mlink maybe price but like Rich said (It's not what you pay. It's what you get for what you pay) and trust me I've got what I paid for a few times and didn't like the out come and it was all about about doing my homework.  I hit Brandt with the hard question's because we all know as he has stated many times he buy's new equipment and top notch, nothing wrong with that, so I was surprised when he pulled the trigger on the Brother then getting the Mlink on loan, which to Brandt's credit he did say he didn't know about the Mlink at that time.  This is a good thread but I'm going to ask hard question's because our pocket's don't hang to our ankle's and I want to get the best machine for our bucks that will make us bucks, so far the the Mlink looks like a good machine but still out of the range I would like to pay at this time, but would still like to hear about other brother user's...at one time my choice was the Anajet & Epson.

[GraphicDisorder]

Darryl/3Deep who is looking into a DTG right now would probably love a free 90 days of printing/time to make more off offering DTG. But is that available to all? Otherwise this is a good head head comparison of print quality, but nothing else.

Darryl doesn't have another machine does he? I am pretty certain that is the only reason I had the offer of the Mlink to compare.

I am confused how this thread is only valid comparison for print quality...nothing else?  Print speed, print quality, ink costs, ease of use, waste ink, this goes on and on with comparisons does it not? I mean I would hope many would compare more than just print quality....

You are comparing 2 machines, one is 60% more expensive.

Try comparing 2 other machines that have a 60% price difference, the M-Link and the M-Link Plus, which one do you think will be a better investment in the long run??

So I guess since you zipped past most of my post you don't find print speed/quality/ink use/maintenance/waste/down time/etc all relevant points?

Yes of course the machine costs more. Just like many Autos cost more than many others, but most of us still seem to have higher end machines.  Why is that I wonder? The Brother also has ink costs that in case's we have seen is as much as 5-6x PER PRINT. Guess that's a big deal to me when I will be retailing a tshirt for around $20 and id like as much margin in each as I can. I don't plan to run a couple shirts a day, I am hoping to run 2-3k shirts a year at least off a DTG after I get it going and I frankly feel like if I put the time in that's a drop in the bucket in my market. At that rate it wont take long to make up that difference in money with the loss of a couple hours a week to maintenance and the high cost of ink wouldn't you say? Math says even based on a few of our typical prints (front and rear) id make up that machine cost difference just off ink cost in a year or so. These are things that must be pointed out and everyone sorta sweeps them under the rug and only looks at initial machine cost. Guess that's why there are loads of Tjets that don't work and loads of Epson based DTG's that seem to come in and out of the market quick. Heck even Epson is in the game now.

If print speed/quality/maintenance/ink use/waste/down time are all not relevant to the discussion some how I guess I don't understand that.  Forgive me for bringing those up. I fail to see how it's just about price of machine.  If it was there are many cheaper than the Brother.

As far as comparing a MlinkX Vs the Mlink, they are the same machine, ones just faster. I am not certain of my market yet but maybe when this test it up Ill buy a Mlink X... never know. I dont have another machine to compare it to here. At least someone is comparing machine differences and talking about real ink costs of these machines. I have seen very little of that on ANY machine outside manufactures talking about some optimal artwork at some small print size.   

[GraphicDisorder]

Alex you are correct, we went to the show and thought we found the machine we wanted to buy, turns out I didn't have all the info I needed and the machine I thought was good has bad reviews' and the one I like was price to high for us and the other machine would cost us a ton ink wasted ink.  I'm not knocking the Mlink maybe price but like Rich said (It's not what you pay. It's what you get for what you pay) and trust me I've got what I paid for a few times and didn't like the out come and it was all about about doing my homework.  I hit Brandt with the hard question's because we all know as he has stated many times he buy's new equipment and top notch, nothing wrong with that, so I was surprised when he pulled the trigger on the Brother then getting the Mlink on loan, which to Brandt's credit he did say he didn't know about the Mlink at that time.  This is a good thread but I'm going to ask hard question's because our pocket's don't hang to our ankle's and I want to get the best machine for our bucks that will make us bucks, so far the the Mlink looks like a good machine but still out of the range I would like to pay at this time, but would still like to hear about other brother user's...at one time my choice was the Anajet & Epson.

You should buy the machine that fits you best. Ive mentioned both machines are great quality. Both are similar in speed and print quality. But don't ignore ink costs, waste, down time etc. That's the whole point of this thread because people aren't really talking about those things much. In Brothers booth you know what they told me that day at SGIA?  $1.60 a print was average cost and then he said to me....double it to be safe per print. So I was OK at that.  So far we've only seen a single print at the range of $1.60 and it wasn't a full size print. Anything large has been a lot more. So remember these manufactures are going to tell you optimal info. In my situation based on where we are today, I think id be saving money before year 2 on the Mlink. I am not sure how many of you are buying a DTG for just a year or so of use but I am guessing most of you are buying them for longer term use than that.

[bulldog]

The maintenance on a Brother is what steered me away from it. You start digging on tshirtforums and you'll see a lot of people complain about that.

15 minutes in the morning is not really a big deal if you're going to run the machine for the next 8 hours.

I think there are two types of people in DTG. Ones that just want to do fill ins and one offs where they might not use the machine much or on the flip side you have people looking to run 1000s a year on one.

For the first group, the cost of the machine is going to be a huge factor, ink won't be as noticeable because they don't use that much. Second group has to look more closely at everything. The ink difference on the Mlink vs Brother (though I am one that thinks the Brother is using too much) is enough to pay for the difference in no time, way less than a year.

So far, at 40k the Mlink looks like a bargain compared to the Brother just on ink and maintenance. It will be interesting to see how they still compare in a month or so if Brandt hasn't gone Office Space on the Brother yet.

[GraphicDisorder]

The maintenance on a Brother is what steered me away from it. You start digging on tshirtforums and you'll see a lot of people complain about that.

15 minutes in the morning is not really a big deal if you're going to run the machine for the next 8 hours.

I think there are two types of people in DTG. Ones that just want to do fill ins and one offs where they might not use the machine much or on the flip side you have people looking to run 1000s a year on one.

For the first group, the cost of the machine is going to be a huge factor, ink won't be as noticeable because they don't use that much. Second group has to look more closely at everything. The ink difference on the Mlink vs Brother (though I am one that thinks the Brother is using too much) is enough to pay for the difference in no time, way less than a year.

So far, at 40k the Mlink looks like a bargain compared to the Brother just on ink and maintenance. It will be interesting to see how they still compare in a month or so if Brandt hasn't gone Office Space on the Brother yet.

You've pretty much nailed my opinion thus far.  Both still being great machines. Id keep and still may keep the Brother in some contexts. But right now for sure ink cost/use and how it would not even clear the heads this morning after 2hrs I find to be things I have to be concerned with.

[Dottonedan]

Maintenance was the main reason we ditched the DTG side of things. Now we didn't have either of the machines in this thread, but it was 15min every morning. Printed nice, but when you are use to screen printing or running a auto DTG for us was WAY too much of a time eater if we didn't have shirts lined up for the whole day.

It's not what you pay. It's what you get for what you pay. Just a FYI.

While I agree with this, you kinda skewed the situation here. If someone is looking to get a better machine that is 60% more expensive initially, sometimes that extra initial price is hard to swing. Be it a approved lease amount, cash on hand, whatever. But if you are coming in and GIVING the nicer machine to someone for free for 90 days or whatever, that makes the whole thing waaaaaaaaay different. Who wouldn't go with the initially higher priced machine then???

Darryl/3Deep who is looking into a DTG right now would probably love a free 90 days of printing/time to make more off offering DTG. But is that available to all? Otherwise this is a good head head comparison of print quality, but nothing else.

Skewed?

I occasionally give my art or some art training files away every now and then. When I do, I've been questioned as to why I didn't give more ....and also criticized for how I do my process or the quality of the vid. It's that ole "Gift horse" thing.

[IntegrityShirts]

I've learned a lot from this thread. Namely, I don't ever want a DTG machine lol what a nightmare. ROI on these things is so hard to justify in light of all the additional gotchas with cleanings, ink costs, unexpected down time. Seems almost cruel to sell one to a person who thinks it's all they need to print $$. Like the guy in the mall with a single head embroidery machine doing hats one by one.

[bulldog]

I've learned a lot from this thread. Namely, I don't ever want a DTG machine lol what a nightmare. ROI on these things is so hard to justify in light of all the additional gotchas with cleanings, ink costs, unexpected down time. Seems almost cruel to sell one to a person who thinks it's all they need to print $$. Like the guy in the mall with a single head embroidery machine doing hats one by one.

I don't know about that. Let's say you buy a decent automatic at 20k and let's say you make $3 a shirt gross profit. It would take you 6667 shirts to recoup that money. Take a 40k DTG printer and you make $10 gross profit a shirt, it takes you 4000 shirts for a return. Obviously, those numbers can change a lot up or down. Now, the question is, what is quicker for you? Most people here could probably sell 6667 shirts via screen printing faster than 4000 via DTG, for sure.

There are also things you don't necessarily think of when buying an auto, such as chiller/compressor, wiring. You learn about that through research, or the hard way. DTG is pretty similar, I would say.

I guess it is all about perspective.