Shop Owner - Looking into acquiring an Embroidering System

[Sirchopz]

Hey Mentor Squad, i have a couple of Questions about Embroidering. I have been screen-printing for 13 yrs. I turn down many jobs for Embroidering because I do not have one. What I send them to a couple of guys that I know they do that. But lately I have been getting more and more request for it. Ever since I got involved with schools. 

Question 1: Should I buy a embroidering system?

Question 2: Which kind? I have $12K to spend.

What will be the Pros/Cons from all Squads experience?

Thank you
Chopz.

[mk162]

1. yes.

2. look for a used barudan or tajima.  4 head preferably, but $12 might not get you enough machine.  A 2 head isn't bad, but it's slow.

[Sirchopz]

MK162, so you recommend a wait a bit more to come up with more cash? Your thoughts?

[mk162]

either that or take out a loan.  keep your cash.  Barudan's lease is pretty easy.

There are tax advantages for loans or leases.  Check with your CPA.

[GraphicDisorder]

12k Wont get you real far unless you go pretty old, don't forget software as well.  Which isn't cheap.  Figure 3k-15k for that. 

Single head will frustrate you and you wont make real money.  Go 2 head at least.  4 Head if you want to make money, 6 if you have space as often the cost to go to 6 head from 4 isn't much difference.

[Sirchopz]

Thank you all for this eye opener...I will look into a loan this will be the first time I do this...

[T Shirt Farmer]

Do Not produce your own digitizing until you learn to run the embroidery machine, you will have your hands full with that alone JMO

[GraphicDisorder]

To help you decide. Lets say you average 15k Stitch files and you can run it 1k stitches per minute and there is zero time between runs and no machine stops (LOL).

That's:
4 per hour on a 1 head
8 per hour on a 2 head
16 per hour on a 4 head
24 per hour on a 6 head

Let's say you are getting $5 per item. 
That's:
$20 per hour on a 1 head
$40 per hour on a 2 head
$80 per hour on a 4 head
$120 per hour on a 6 head

Then consider what you pay someone a hour to run it, you can see how on a single head that wouldn't get you far. Then consider time to digitize files or cost to have them digitized.  If you paid some kid $10 a hour to run your 1 head your lucky if you make $10 a hour on that machine before thread/materials/overhead/taxes/etc.  Then consider running a 6 head paying that same $10 a hour.  Your making money. But then again you wont get much of a operator for $10 a hour.

Do Not produce your own digitizing until you learn to run the embroidery machine, you will have your hands full with that alone JMO

Also excellent advice.

[Sirchopz]

WOW. real information. Thank you.

This means on software; i can send the design somewhere to get digitize. Correct?

[mk162]

yes there are plenty of online digitizers.

I do recommend simple software for edits like color changes, names and so on. 

[mooseman]

just sent you a PM contact me if you are interested.
mooseman

[blue moon]

To help you decide. Lets say you average 15k Stitch files and you can run it 1k stitches per minute and there is zero time between runs and no machine stops (LOL).

That's:
4 per hour on a 1 head
8 per hour on a 2 head
16 per hour on a 4 head
24 per hour on a 6 head

Let's say you are getting $5 per item. 
That's:
$20 per hour on a 1 head
$40 per hour on a 2 head
$80 per hour on a 4 head
$120 per hour on a 6 head

Then consider what you pay someone a hour to run it, you can see how on a single head that wouldn't get you far. Then consider time to digitize files or cost to have them digitized.  If you paid some kid $10 a hour to run your 1 head your lucky if you make $10 a hour on that machine before thread/materials/overhead/taxes/etc.  Then consider running a 6 head paying that same $10 a hour.  Your making money. But then again you wont get much of a operator for $10 a hour.

Do Not produce your own digitizing until you learn to run the embroidery machine, you will have your hands full with that alone JMO

Also excellent advice.

this is a good example of what you should be thinking! GD also mentions that the numbers are best case scenario, no breaks and running at 1k stitches per minute. My guess is you will average $75 per hour on a 6 head if you get everything properly organized.

two thoughts here,
a properly running automatic can bring you four times as much per hour, would you be better off selling more screenprinting? The return can be much higher.
second, if you are going to do this, run some numbers and figure out realistically what you can get in sales and see if it's worth it. Take GD's numbers and divide them in half. Can you make money with that after you pay all the expenses (admin overhead, garment handling before production, actual embroidery, trim/steam after production, shipping/delivery and administrative to close the paperwork and collect the money)?

pierre

[GraphicDisorder]

Exactly, the real numbers are worse. I gave optimal situation and its still poor outlook for 1-2 head really. I would suggest cutting at least 1/3rd off it is more realistic, sometimes its in half as suggested.  Knowing what I know now, id never buy less than a 4 head. Ever.

Now of course you will have jobs that are more profitable and such but you have to work off some real numbers.

[mk162]

I disagree with Brandt on the 4 head thing...here's why...

Depending on your market a 1-2 head machine can supplement a 4-6 head machine with things like names, numbers or even small runs that a larger machine would lose to many heads for.

I would never start with a machine with less than 4 heads, that's for sure.  But a 1-2 can be a great addition to a shop that does more customization.

[GraphicDisorder]

I disagree with Brandt on the 4 head thing...here's why...

Depending on your market a 1-2 head machine can supplement a 4-6 head machine with things like names, numbers or even small runs that a larger machine would lose to many heads for.

I would never start with a machine with less than 4 heads, that's for sure.  But a 1-2 can be a great addition to a shop that does more customization.

I know this, id sure feel a lot worse about having a single head and not being able to go faster than I would about having a 6 head that only has 1 head being used for 1 item now and then. Ill never understand the worry about empty heads on a machine now and then.

That is like saying don't buy a car that can go over the speed limit, since you aren't using it the excess at all times. The idea of a machine is that it should be able to do things faster or in higher volume when needed. You don't have to fill it up all the time, it wont melt. I promise