Split from Spyder CTS, any users on this board?

[Dottonedan]

Separate unit for exposure for sure.  If M&R STE CTS is down I can print film on inkjet and still unable to expose screen ? No thank you.

I agree. Any shop that has any device from any company should still always keep a backup. Just like if you need to get to work and your car breaks down, you need an alternative source. All machines "can" break down, but some more than others. Sort of like an expensive car and an economy car. Expensive cars can break down, but probably less often. What is also important, is how the company reacts to your situation if it does.

That brings me back to price. There are other (after purchase factors) to consider in every purchase. An higher initial cost does not make a loss in a comparison.

I'm not in sales and make no additional $ on promoting one over the other.  I'm  simply starting to know a good bit about them so, I'm just giving you suggestions on areas to really look at closely that are not seen up front.

If speed is of no concern, and those that are in the running, are of equal speed, then focus on the following to other owners who have one of each model or type.

Cost of head replacement
Frequency of head replacement
research on types of heads.
Ink usage per screen.
Wax usage per screen
Cost per square foot of an equal coverage.

To be direct, I don't have answers for all of those above.

[Gilligan]

I'm not in sales and make no additional $ on promoting one over the other....

That's a little disingenuous... Your job depends on those sales regardless if you make a commission or not.

[Dottonedan]

I'm not in sales and make no additional $ on promoting one over the other....

That's a little disingenuous... Your job depends on those sales regardless if you make a commission or not.

Lets not get too rediculous about it. In theory, somewhere down the line I could benefit or not benefit in so much as someone in our department including myself could "technically" maintain ones job for an additional couple days or months if I were to somehow sway a decision on a sale in our direction....but is (the vague path to prosperity that I would reep) really worth mentioning? It's not even interesting for commenting on, except for one more...

Our department is and will be flourishing with or without me and what I say. What does matter tho, is that you all happen to be able to get good honest, direct first hand knowledge and have access to that, so long as you all continue to allow me the ability to share that knowledge with you. You can choose to take it or leave it, I just ask that you be respectful.

[Gilligan]

I was simply saying that you do have a vested interest in promoting one over the other.  You install these machines for M&R.  If Kiwo comes out and crushes it and creates a machine that makes M&R put theirs next to the Auto Stacking machine then you will have to find something else to do.

That's all I'm saying.  Full disclosure never hurt anyone, I certainly don't feel that it is disrespectful in any facet.

[Dottonedan]

Disengenuous felt like you were calling me a liar simply because of where I work and my content is skewed for that reason. Luckily for me, It's both easy to say it's a solid machine and also true. Outside of that, the content of all of my post, never mentioned one brand being better than another. They just give examples of things to consider or to gather more direct information that would prove itself beneficial to the buyer.

I think that is as fair and balanced as I need to be. It's already hard enough to work this forum and have to convince people of not playing favorites, while telling it like it is. So seeing you point out some distant benefits seemed unnecessary and daluting my credibility as someone having something of value to say on the subject. That's all.

One thing I know, Rich himself would never stand for me or anyone to lie or stretch the truth in our favor.  The product will speak for itself and if it can't, we will make it better (if) it's a viable change overall, or meaning, it would be a feasible change that would benefit the majority. Some change request may not be beneficial to everyone, thus unnessesarily increasing cost to those who don't need it.

[Gilligan]

I specifically quoted that single part of your statement because that was the only part I took exception with.

The thing is, because it is hard to walk that line you have to walk, that is all the more reason to be as upfront as possible.

And again, it's not a distant connection.  You don't work for the NuArc division and your stock holdings might go up if they push a few more units, you install the machines themselves.  This does give you direct insight into the product but it also certainly gives you a reason to want to see these units do well.  To say ANYTHING else IS disingenuous.

[Dottonedan]

I'd have to call bullsqueeze on that one.

[Gilligan]

Not sure what you are calling BS on.  Either you are calling me BS/liar... which holy sh!t, WTF is your problem.

OR you are suggesting what I'm saying is still off... in that case it's just getting more and more revealing, to the point that I was hoping wasn't the case.

[Dottonedan]

Enough convoluted drama. Let's make this about the machines and answers.

[ebscreen]

Subject line is asking about another manufacturers machine. Response is from board owner that is employee of competing manufacturer
with "information" regarding their machine. In the name of a free and open board, as well as a level playing field, I'd argue there is
a conflict of interest there somewhere.

[Dottonedan]

Subject line is asking about another manufacturers machine. Response is from board owner that is employee of competing manufacturer
with "information" regarding their machine. In the name of a free and open board, as well as a level playing field, I'd argue there is
a conflict of interest there somewhere.

The response, says nothing about any one Co or its product. It gives areas of impactful results of interest to review with each and every model or brand.

What I hear you say, is the fact that I was part owner several year before working with them,  all the while, never speaking ill of any of these other companies before, or during working here, and the fact that I have years and years of industry knowledge and credibility means nothing to you "because of where I work".

I see. I had never really given it that much credit that people would use it against me, but I see now.

[blue moon]

I am gonna have to side with Dan on this one. In the years I've known him, he's always been a stand up, no lying kind of guy (might hold his ground and argue with you, but WILL NOT lie to you!). I also don't think his livelihood depends on the DTS sales as I am certain Rich would use him for something else if that division would close (for some reason I can't even come up with considering their success).

Yes, at this point he might be biased, but any one of us that is not biased towards the products we are offering is probably in the wrong business. We ALL think that our product is better than our competitor's and we ALL try to make it better in some way. Dan is human after all and there is absolutely no way we should hold that against him (since it applies to every one of us). I think at this point we should give Dan credit for holding back and not pushing the product he works on!

It also is true that Dan did not mention any manufacturer in his post and never implied anything about the M&R or Exile.  Both Dan and I have heard from unhappy Exile customers and Dan never brought it up. That is the right move and is something to be expected from a guy like Dan.

Sorry Gilligan, I would gladly take your side if you had the case, but will have to politely disagree with you here. . . .

pierre

[GraphicDisorder]

I am gonna have to side with Dan on this one. In the years I've known him, he's always been a stand up, no lying kind of guy (might hold his ground and argue with you, but WILL NOT lie to you!). I also don't think his livelihood depends on the DTS sales as I am certain Rich would use him for something else if that division would close (for some reason I can't even come up with considering their success).

Yes, at this point he might be biased, but any one of us that is not biased towards the products we are offering is probably in the wrong business. We ALL think that our product is better than our competitor's and we ALL try to make it better in some way. Dan is human after all and there is absolutely no way we should hold that against him (since it applies to every one of us). I think at this point we should give Dan credit for holding back and not pushing the product he works on!

It also is true that Dan did not mention any manufacturer in his post and never implied anything about the M&R or Exile.  Both Dan and I have heard from unhappy Exile customers and Dan never brought it up. That is the right move and is something to be expected from a guy like Dan.

Sorry Gilligan, I would gladly take your side if you had the case, but will have to politely disagree with you here. . . .

pierre

[GraphicDisorder]

Subject line is asking about another manufacturers machine. Response is from board owner that is employee of competing manufacturer
with "information" regarding their machine. In the name of a free and open board, as well as a level playing field, I'd argue there is
a conflict of interest there somewhere.

The response, says nothing about any one Co or its product. It gives areas of impactful results of interest to review with each and every model or brand.

What I hear you say, is the fact that I was part owner several year before working with them,  all the while, never speaking ill of any of these other companies before, or during working here, and the fact that I have years and years of industry knowledge and credibility means nothing to you "because of where I work".

I see. I had never really given it that much credit that people would use it against me, but I see now.

Dan, you've never come off to me and I highly doubt many others as a fan boy even after you started working for M&R you've generally remained really neutral in your postings which requires effort in your position that you are not getting credit for.  So kudos there to you. 

[Frog]

As I told Dan, and he agrees that he knows it, he walks a somwhat finer line now that M&R is his employer. He will have to make a concerted effort sometimes to eliminate any thought that his contributions here are slanted in that direction.
He's doing pretty well, and it would be a great disservice to the membership to lose his input and expertise in this field.

Try to look at the big picture, and also give him the benefit of the doubt.