Ganging Images-split from DTS pros and cons

[alan802]

Of those watching this thread, who gangs up images on screens?  We have 2 images on most every screen we expose but it seems like it's not quite as popular a method as I thought.  We'll never change that technique but I'd like to hear comments on why it's not done or why others like to do it. 

[Gilligan]

We just did 3 left chest AND a full back on one screen yesterday... Running the job today, I'll snap a pic.

[bulldog]

Most of my designs are 10x10 or 12x12 or smaller. So yeah, gang them. Seems such a waste when only doing one!

[ericheartsu]

Of those watching this thread, who gangs up images on screens?  We have 2 images on most every screen we expose but it seems like it's not quite as popular a method as I thought.  We'll never change that technique but I'd like to hear comments on why it's not done or why others like to do it.

when we were doing film we would gang as much as we could. With the I-Image, we dont gang more than 2. We also don't gang images on long runs, or discharge runs longer than 60pcs.

[GraphicDisorder]

Almost every shirt back we do is 15x17 inches, so no ganging those.  Fronts are so all over the place many are center chest, some are vertical, left chest is less common here.  When we can we do it of course, but its always logistically hard to at times remember to stick a left chest from Tuesday with one from Friday at times. 

[Underbase37]

We gang screens all day long.(film) I feel like I'm wasting screens when I can't, but sometimes it just can't happen. 

Murphy37

[Gilligan]

We just moved to auto sized frames so when my guy ganged his first job (and for a contract customer), it clicked and he proclaimed, "I just doubled our money on screen charges!" lol

[jsheridan]

our processes are setup to where we don't have to gang. I can and do, but it adds extra time on press with taping and whatnot so we just don't do it.

I find it's quicker to pull a screen and put in a fresh clean one.

i'm not trying to save a screen or save room, i'm saving time on press so my guys have maximum use of the minutes in a day to be productive.

[ebscreen]

our processes are setup to where we don't have to gang. I can and do, but it adds extra time on press with taping and whatnot so we just don't do it.

I find it's quicker to pull a screen and put in a fresh clean one.

i'm not trying to save a screen or save room, i'm saving time on press so my guys have maximum use of the minutes in a day to be productive.

This is where we are headed as well. It's tough to force yourself to leave all that usable real estate but in the end it's faster.
Every time I see them wiping ink, de-taping, etc. it's a reminder that it takes 5 minutes of non-press time to clean a screen.

[bimmridder]

I agree with John. We don't do it often at all, but if an order calls for a color change, it's a new screen for us. Faster to swap out than to clean, dry, re-tape. But that for me, not for everyone.

[alan802]

But to put an additional screen into the rotation it's 20 minutes for the average shop.  I'm sure there are shops that can do everything a screen needs in 15 minutes but less than that and I'd have to see it in person.  And there are shops that probably can't do a screen in less than 25 minutes.  A new screen has to be reclaimed, coated, taped, setup, torn down, de-taped, etc. and I'd say on the worst case scenario we'd spend 7-10 minutes dealing with a ganged image and on average it's probably half of that.  I'm not trying to change anyone's mind, just giving the logic I use to decide how to do it.  I know the labor is spread around so that it may not seem like 20 minutes but that's what I get when putting times to every process.   

[alan802]

Maybe I'm not looking at this through the right glasses, that's why I asked the question.

[GKitson]

But to put an additional screen into the rotation it's 20 minutes for the average shop.  I'm sure there are shops that can do everything a screen needs in 15 minutes but less than that and I'd have to see it in person.  And there are shops that probably can't do a screen in less than 25 minutes.  A new screen has to be reclaimed, coated, taped, setup, torn down, de-taped, etc. and I'd say on the worst case scenario we'd spend 7-10 minutes dealing with a ganged image and on average it's probably half of that.  I'm not trying to change anyone's mind, just giving the logic I use to decide how to do it.  I know the labor is spread around so that it may not seem like 20 minutes but that's what I get when putting times to every process.   

Alan you are right on with the 20 minute number for screen cycle time in an efficient shop.  You are also correct that it can be much more but the real question is how fast can you do press changeover?  You are not making money unless the press is making noise.

I've said it a million times, most of us are more screen makers than screen printers.

In our workflow ganging screens causes people to ask unnecessary questions and slows things down, therefore 1 screen with 1 image makes the press make more noise which in turn makes more money.  Yep we are accepting increased time in the screen loop but the dollars support the decision.  The bigger the shop the more this makes sense.

~Kitson

[mimosatexas]

I'd say it is undoubtedly more efficient to gang on a per screen basis, but honestly I rarely do it either as it seems to interrupt my flow to clean screens or worry about inkwell taping and contamination etc.  I am a small shop and I much prefer to do work in chunks rather than in the middle of a random day.  Burn screens for the day in the morning or for a few days, print all the jobs, clean and coat all at once.

[alan802]

But to put an additional screen into the rotation it's 20 minutes for the average shop.  I'm sure there are shops that can do everything a screen needs in 15 minutes but less than that and I'd have to see it in person.  And there are shops that probably can't do a screen in less than 25 minutes.  A new screen has to be reclaimed, coated, taped, setup, torn down, de-taped, etc. and I'd say on the worst case scenario we'd spend 7-10 minutes dealing with a ganged image and on average it's probably half of that.  I'm not trying to change anyone's mind, just giving the logic I use to decide how to do it.  I know the labor is spread around so that it may not seem like 20 minutes but that's what I get when putting times to every process.   

Alan you are right on with the 20 minute number for screen cycle time in an efficient shop.  You are also correct that it can be much more but the real question is how fast can you do press changeover?  You are not making money unless the press is making noise.

I've said it a million times, most of us are more screen makers than screen printers.

In our workflow ganging screens causes people to ask unnecessary questions and slows things down, therefore 1 screen with 1 image makes the press make more noise which in turn makes more money.  Yep we are accepting increased time in the screen loop but the dollars support the decision.  The bigger the shop the more this makes sense.

~Kitson

That's why I asked, this is why this forum is what it is...which is great for anyone with an open mind and a willingness to learn.  I'll go back and see what the affect is on press downtime and put that into the equation more than looking at it from the narrow standpoint I was.  It still might not add up but it's worth a look.