S-Mesh Statics review

[Gilligan]

would your customers really be happy with a 1-hit white?  I've never seen a 'true 1-hit' that looks anywhere near as good as a pfp.

Go visit Alan.

Now is it worth the effort?  That's debatable, but his prints aren't.

[Prosperi-Tees]

I think I will toss a 2nd screen on there since its 1000 pcs white and red on black both sides, definitely want to do that in one revolution

[Gilligan]

I think I will toss a 2nd screen on there since its 1000 pcs white and red on black both sides, definitely want to do that in one revolution

Glad you got that job!

[Prosperi-Tees]

Us too, we sent them a postcard last Friday and they called us on Tuesday, met with them today and should an order early next week.

[Gilligan]

Us too, we sent them a postcard last Friday and they called us on Tuesday, met with them today and should an order early next week.

So you got that job off of a post card?!  That's awesome!

[Prosperi-Tees]

Yup the guy said that day he got the ok from corporate to find a local screen printer and our card showed up!

[brandon]

would your customers really be happy with a 1-hit white?  I've never seen a 'true 1-hit' that looks anywhere near as good as a pfp.

For us water base printers discharge works just fine 

[bulldog]

Most of our "one hits" come from lower mesh counts like 120/54 and 90/71's and we haven't had a ton of luck with getting one hits through a 135 but honestly it hasn't been tried near as much as with a 120 or 90.  I know the don't stock those mesh counts but they should start.  I get those counts and put on the roller frames so I am not as limited in what we can use because of that.  I love the 120/54 and I can't say enough about what they can do.

Hey Alan,

I'm new here and well, forgive me, I still have much to learn. When you're talking about the 120/54 or 90/71 how do you find the 2nd number? Generally all you see listed on sites is just 110 or 128, etc. What type of mesh are you talking about and is there a chart or anything?

Thanks,
Brandon

[ScreenPrinter123]

Bulldog,

If you end up getting the 120's ignore Alan and get the 120/48's (60% open area) as opposed to the 120/54's (50 something % open area).  Alan doesn't know what he's missing. 

[prozyan]

The second number is thread diameter.  A 120/48 has 120 threads per inch and each thread has a diameter of 48.  A 120/54 has an equal number of threads per inch, but each thread is thicker.

Thicker thread means slightly less open area between each thread.  The trade-off is thicker threads are more durable than thin thread.

ETA:  The general thinking is that thin mesh performs considerably better than the thicker thread mesh.

[ScreenPrinter123]

What prozyan said...

If your supplier doesn't know the 2nd # get your mesh from someone else. Take it from someone who used generic mesh up until 2-3 years ago - better mesh is a game changer.

[alan802]

would your customers really be happy with a 1-hit white?  I've never seen a 'true 1-hit' that looks anywhere near as good as a pfp.

Printing without flashing on tons of jobs every year saves us thousands of dollars, easy 5 figures, but it also doesn't take us that long to set the job up.  If it takes you an hour to get a one hit job set up correctly then yeah, probably not worth it.  Generally speaking, a PFP should always look better from a few feet away versus a one hit but the goal is to reach 100% opacity with the thinnest layer of ink possible and anything over 100% is wasting ink.  Which I would bet that most shops that PFP are able to get the first stroke/print to 70% opacity, then they flash, print that again, and they are now at essentially 140% opacity (really 40% more ink usage versus what it takes to reach 100%) so there is a huge waste of ink going on in most shops, and the suppliers REALLY love the shops that PFP everything no matter what.  The majority of the designs we do you have to PFP, but any time we can get away with just doing one stroke and throw it on the belt, the more money we make.   

[ABuffington]

The question was raised here about the second number in a mesh count, like 150/48 mesh, which is a 150S mesh here in the US.  The rest of the world prefers using the thread diameter for the second number, here in the US we use letters to denote the thickness of thread.  From thinnest to thickest thread: SS, S, M, T, HD.  Here is our mesh guide link:

http://www.murakamiscreen.com/documents/MeshGuidefromCatalogweb.pdf

You can see the relationship between thread diameter and the letter description.  It should be noted that what can be an S thread in one mesh like 80/71 or 80/S becomes a T thread in a higher mesh count like 125/71 or 125/T, one reason that using the thread diameter is more accurate.  For ease of printing and especially opacity the percentage of open area is also helpful.  150/48 (150/S) has a 51% open area, 110/80 (110/T) has a 43% open area.  So for base plates, discharge and water base, the open area tells me how easy the ink will print through similar meshes for the same use.  Ink volume also tells you how much ink per square meter will be used in centimeters.  If you print a ton of white base ink this alone will convince you to change your base plate mesh.  I have a 40 auto shop customer who became more competitive and profitable by using 1/3 less white base ink with S meshes.

[bulldog]

Bulldog,

If you end up getting the 120's ignore Alan and get the 120/48's (60% open area) as opposed to the 120/54's (50 something % open area).  Alan doesn't know what he's missing. 

Ah ok, Alan (Buffington), that makes a lot of sense now. So the 120/48 that ScreenPrinter123 mentioned is a 120S and the 120/54 that Alan mentioned are actually a 120M.

Correct? And so the 120S would lay down slightly more ink than the 120M?

[prozyan]

And so the 120S would lay down slightly more ink than the 120M?

Just my opinion, it would be considerably more ink.