Polyester White Plastisol Inks-Choices

[alan802]

So we have Rutland Super Poly, Triangle Excel and Excalibur Athletic white that we've used for printing on poly shirts.  I know Wilflex has their Top Score inks and Union Athletic white, One Stroke has one that a local shop is using so I know we have quite a few choices.  I would like to know what everyone is using for a 100% poly red that has a white imprint? 

We carry some low bleed spot colors but we haven't invested in the inks that cure at 290 to 300 degrees and since these 100% poly shirts are taking over around here, I'm thinking it might be time to get a system like the top score from Wilflex or something comparable.  With inks curing at 290, we still won't be able to set the dryer to a temp below 320 so the shirts will be reaching the magic 320 degrees no matter what ink we use.  For our ink temp to reach 310, the dryer is set to 360-370 with a belt speed of 20'/min which allows us to print fairly fast, but you see the ink temp lags far behind the actual temp inside the dryer but the shirts themselves get up to the 360-370 easily.

On another note, I just looked at a sample print we did with the Rutland Poly a few months back and compared it to a print we did earlier this week and the change is dramatic.  There is far more puff in the last gallon than the test prints I did a few months ago and it's bubbling up in so many places.  The bubbling will stop when I turn the dryer down to where I know the inks are not reaching 300 but I don't have any donut probe numbers to back up my thoughts but I know that dryer well.  I've ran hundreds of probe tests through the dryer and know how the inks react at what temp and belt speed to have a good idea. 

We just had another job that was on sport tek 100% poly shirts and we've seen major shrinkage before with these shirts but this time it's bad enough that we have to replace shirts.  The conversation with our rep that we bought the shirts from didn't go well and they sent me the "tip sheet" for printing on 100% poly shirts and the contradictions on that sheet are freaking hilarious.  It says to use 85-110 mesh but only flash for 1-2 seconds, ha.  Then it says to put a layer of dyno grey base through an 85-110 then our standard poly white through the same mesh count then top colors if needed BUT the shirt must not get over 320 degrees.  Most of us that have mapped our dryers with a donut probe or those of us that have dryers with accurate temp readings know that to get the entire ink deposit that has been printed with at least 2 layers of ink through 85-110 mesh without getting the shirt itself over 320 would require a belt speed so slow that we'd never get anything done.   It also says to not get the shirts over 320 because of dye migration, but most of us know that dye migration occurs at a much lower temp, 250 degrees.

Sorry for the additional read but what is everyone using for 100% poly shirts?

[whitewater]

We use the Union Athletic.. i like it.. the coaches come back in they are wearing the poly shirts we printed the white on and still look great.  We have not printed on red but we do a ton on maroon poly.

[aauusa]

i cannot say it enough use one stroke color max white.  yes it is more $ but you will no longer have any of these issues.  Plus if you tell one stroke what shirt you are printing they will tell you the best ink for it, as they have tested most of our industry fabrics.  my contact is robb mears.

[Printficient]

Reg or Mustang here.

[GaryG]

On other posts too:
Wilflex Extreme first choice / Quick second
-156 -Flash- 156
Not too much heat in dryer and covers enough as not to raise and pucker fabric.

[ZooCity]

Get a bucket of WFX Performance White and try it.  Skip the Top Score White, inferior coverage and stretch properties to Performance.  Perf will cost you but you'll be repaid on press and with the finished print.  1% or so of viscosity buster if/when it's really needed.  Warm and stir first before assuming it needs the v buster. 

Stupid slow belt speed is a plus and will be needed on the worst of it but you can solve a lot of issues with this in pre-press, steering clients away from big, blocky areas right from the get go.  It's an easy sell- you don't want your moisture wicking performance shirt covered in a non-breathable patch.   Out belt runs at about 5 (TexAir w. 10' chamber) for all jobs except those where we can get away with boosting the panel temp and need more belt capacity. 

I've never had a poly shirt shrink on us like you described but we tend to run less of those jobs and higher volume when they come through so I haven't experienced it all.  I default to SanMar's stuff a lot (ST350 is often the best deal available) and have found UltraClub to run fine as well. 

[Lizard]

Hey Alan,

I know some have talked about the silicone ink on here and I also talked to another shop in my area recently about this ink a few weeks ago. The guy I was talking to does a bunch of poly and just got tired of all the problems with it so he has been using it and claims it is amazing. You may want to try some if you are doing a lot of poly printing.

We just don't do a huge amount of poly but when we do we run the dryer at around 350 and about 45 seconds dwell. Don't usually have issues. If we get above that temp it is hit or miss.

[screenprintguy]

Ran a lot of 100% poly st350's yesterday using the Rutland Super Poly white for the first time. Very thick ink, I think it can actually be reduced a little and work well, will have to try that, but it is suuuuuuuper opaque, very nicely priced, we paid 84 for a gal, and didn't bleed like we have had happen in the past with some others. We were using Wilflex performance white, but between it's price, and the inconsistency we were seeing from bucket to bucket, I think Rutland Super Poly white is our winner for now. Is it just me, or does it have a very unique scent, almost like auto paint lol.

[Rockers]

Wilflex Performance White rocks. The only issue we had was the "ageing" of the ink during transport. Got a lot thicker during the flight which means we have to reduce it a bit.

[GaryG]

Lot of ink info, what about your screen specs guys?
Laying it on thick or hfh? This will tell the neexed second half of
the story.

[ericheartsu]

we have been using the crap out of the ICC low cure white. the hand is incredible out of the bucket. Smooth and easy to print

[IntegrityShirts]

I use Rutland NPT HO Low Bleed White, seems to have a little puff to it, but PFP and it's golden.

[screenprintguy]

Ran the batch of st350's with 160/64. Hoping to have our first smart mesh panels from shurloc in today. I didn't go with the lx want to try the straight "s" panels first. Have a bunch of st350's to do next week and am anxious to see the same ink through the s mesh.

[alan802]

The Rutland super poly that we are using today has too much puff.  We are printing 100% poly hoodies right now and one stroke they are almost perfect but then when you run through the dryer the ink puffs up and then the shirt begins to show through so pfp is a must.  Then we tried going to a higher mesh a bit ago and it's so cold outside the poly white wouldn't go through a 195/55.  They are putting a 180/48 on the press right now to see if we can clear it and I've got the ink inside warming up.  We originally were printing these hoodies through a 123/55 which doesn't deposit a thick layer like you'd think, but pfp with the puff is too tall of an ink deposit for my tastes.

I use Rutland NPT HO Low Bleed White, seems to have a little puff to it, but PFP and it's golden.

I have not heard of this one.

we have been using the crap out of the ICC low cure white. the hand is incredible out of the bucket. Smooth and easy to print

Is that what it's called, "Low Cure White"?

Hey Alan,

I know some have talked about the silicone ink on here and I also talked to another shop in my area recently about this ink a few weeks ago. The guy I was talking to does a bunch of poly and just got tired of all the problems with it so he has been using it and claims it is amazing. You may want to try some if you are doing a lot of poly printing.

We just don't do a huge amount of poly but when we do we run the dryer at around 350 and about 45 seconds dwell. Don't usually have issues. If we get above that temp it is hit or miss.

I have printed some samples of the silicone based white on 100% red poly and it did great as far as bleed resistance goes.  Opacity was ok, the ink was too much like some of the discharge whites though and wouldn't sit on top of the fabric all that well.  The main problem with the silicone ink is price, and then I don't think you can print plastisol on top so using it as an underbase is out.  But for white designs on darks I suppose it would work great if I could stomach the price.

And we have two suggestions for Performance white from Wilflex.  I can have some of that in here on Monday, I might just get that in here to try it out.

Ran a lot of 100% poly st350's yesterday using the Rutland Super Poly white for the first time. Very thick ink, I think it can actually be reduced a little and work well, will have to try that, but it is suuuuuuuper opaque, very nicely priced, we paid 84 for a gal, and didn't bleed like we have had happen in the past with some others. We were using Wilflex performance white, but between it's price, and the inconsistency we were seeing from bucket to bucket, I think Rutland Super Poly white is our winner for now. Is it just me, or does it have a very unique scent, almost like auto paint lol.

It does stink.  No puff issues with your bucket?  The print we are doing this morning was puffing well over 150 microns from it's height before the dryer.

[IntegrityShirts]

It's the EL9074 poly/cotton ink. I'd guess it doesn't puff as much because it's for blends, but I use it on 100% as well. Printing some maroon 100% poly hoodies today. Think the screen is 150/48 but could be a 135. If I can find a spare black poly tee I'll run a couple test prints with it and post the single hit, pfp results.